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 Post subject: Re: How do I say this?
PostPosted: Sun 06 May 2012 10:42 pm 
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I agree completely with Lughaidh on both counts.. Yes, 'Francach' etc can be adjective or noun, but while you can say 'Tá an carr/bia sin Francach' [adjective], with people you have to use the copula: 'Is Francach an fear sin' [noun], or 'Is duine/fear Francach é [adjective].
I think it's the same in French and Spanish: 'je suis francais/soy espanol', where francais and espanol may appear to be adjectives but are really nouns. It's just that the indefinite article is omitted in sentences of that type: 'soy estudiante/je suis professeur etc.

As for the direct relative clause '...who isn't French', while 'nach Francach' is perfectly fine, these are often turned unnecessarily into indirect relatives: 'nach Francach é'. However, in the case of an affirmative direct relative such as 'the only one in my family who is French', I think it's always converted to indirect: 'ar Francach é' rather than the direct 'is Francach'. I don't know why.


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 Post subject: Re: How do I say this?
PostPosted: Sun 06 May 2012 11:30 pm 
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Joined: Sat 17 Sep 2011 11:52 pm
Posts: 460
Errigal wrote:
I agree completely with Lughaidh on both counts.. Yes, 'Francach' etc can be adjective or noun, but while you can say 'Tá an carr/bia sin Francach' [adjective], with people you have to use the copula: 'Is Francach an fear sin' [noun], or 'Is duine/fear Francach é [adjective].
I think it's the same in French and Spanish: 'je suis francais/soy espanol', where francais and espanol may appear to be adjectives but are really nouns. It's just that the indefinite article is omitted in sentences of that type: 'soy estudiante/je suis professeur etc.

As for the direct relative clause '...who isn't French', while 'nach Francach' is perfectly fine, these are often turned unnecessarily into indirect relatives: 'nach Francach é'. However, in the case of an affirmative direct relative such as 'the only one in my family who is French', I think it's always converted to indirect: 'ar Francach é' rather than the direct 'is Francach'. I don't know why.


I will have to learn the terminology such as 'direct relative clause' etc. I am more familiar with my few terms in Irish, so forgive my lack of ability on definitions, etc.

Anyway, the way I would put
The only one in my family who is French is xx
would be
An t-aon Fhrancach atá sa teaghlach ná xx

xx is the only one in my family who is French
Is é xx an t-aon Fhrancach atá sa teaghlach

In both cases the 'my' would be understood

_________________
Bí cinnte de go nglacfaidh triúr le gach aistriúchán a thabharfar.
Be sure to get three in agreement with a translation given.


Last edited by Braoin on Sun 06 May 2012 11:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: How do I say this?
PostPosted: Sun 06 May 2012 11:37 pm 
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Joined: Tue 06 Sep 2011 7:18 pm
Posts: 576
Braoin wrote:
Anyway, the way I would put
The only one in my family who is French is xx
would be
An t-aon fhrancach atá sa teaghlach ná xx

xx is the only one in my family who is French
Is é xx an t-aon fhrancach atá sa teaghlach

In both cases the 'my' would be understood


Any thoughts on ....ar Francach é vs ...nach Francach (with no é) (in terms of structure/validity)? Errigal and Lughaidh say the second one is okay, so it probably is - it is just so alien to anything I've ever heard that I must ask.

BTW, surely, a Bhraoin, you know how important an uppercase letter is in a word such as Francach ;)


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 Post subject: Re: How do I say this?
PostPosted: Sun 06 May 2012 11:56 pm 
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Joined: Sat 17 Sep 2011 11:52 pm
Posts: 460
Scooby wrote:
Braoin wrote:
Anyway, the way I would put
The only one in my family who is French is xx
would be
An t-aon fhrancach atá sa teaghlach ná xx

xx is the only one in my family who is French
Is é xx an t-aon fhrancach atá sa teaghlach

In both cases the 'my' would be understood


Any thoughts on ....ar Francach é vs ...nach Francach (with no é) (in terms of structure/validity)? Errigal and Lughaidh say the second one is okay, so it probably is - it is just so alien to anything I've ever heard that I must ask.

BTW, surely, a Bhraoin, you know how important an uppercase letter is in a word such as Francach ;)


Sorry about that... I'll fix the post.
Thanks for that!!

_________________
Bí cinnte de go nglacfaidh triúr le gach aistriúchán a thabharfar.
Be sure to get three in agreement with a translation given.


Last edited by Braoin on Mon 07 May 2012 9:32 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: How do I say this?
PostPosted: Mon 07 May 2012 6:59 am 
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Joined: Thu 01 Sep 2011 9:55 am
Posts: 2114
Location: 91 - France
a Bhraoin - what I wanted to say is the other way round - not that I'm the only Francach in the family but that all the others are and I'm not - de mo mhuintir (because they're originally from Auvergne, Limousin srl and now partly from Corsica and the older generation speak the local languages)


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