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PostPosted: Sun 21 Dec 2014 10:37 am 
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Location: 91 - France
There are just a few things I'd like to check on - taken from this story.

Caidé atá ar siúl anseo? - would mean - What's going on here? I hadn't seen the word caidé used before - and when I looked it up, they say it means - how long? cá fhad? Perhaps it's Ulster usage?

Chuaigh Biorachán Beag le slat a fháil,
slat a rachadh ar Bhiorachán Mór
ionas nach n-íosfadh sé tuilleadh de na cnóanna.

Is 'rachadh' being used here definitely the subjunctive and not a spelling mistake, as in the rest of the story it's - slat a rachaidh....srl ?
Does this mean that the stick is going to hit Biorachán Mór - ie it's going to lay on him, so to speak?

For those of you who are interested - this edition, available from Litríoch, is bilingual Gáidhlig/Gaeilge and there was also a Gàidhlig/Scots edition published, but unfortunately that's become difficult to get hold of.


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PostPosted: Sun 21 Dec 2014 1:35 pm 
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Here's something else - to end this story they say - a chríoch sin. I've never seen that before. Up till now I thought the usual ending to a story was - sin é. Is this another dialect form and what other words are used to finish a story?


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PostPosted: Sun 21 Dec 2014 3:20 pm 
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franc 91 wrote:
There are just a few things I'd like to check on - taken from this story.

Caidé atá ar siúl anseo? - would mean - What's going on here? I hadn't seen the word caidé used before - and when I looked it up, they say it means - how long? cá fhad? Perhaps it's Ulster usage?

Chuaigh Biorachán Beag le slat a fháil,
slat a rachadh ar Bhiorachán Mór
ionas nach n-íosfadh sé tuilleadh de na cnóanna.

Is 'rachadh' being used here definitely the subjunctive and not a spelling mistake, as in the rest of the story it's - slat a rachaidh....srl ?
Does this mean that the stick is going to hit Biorachán Mór - ie it's going to lay on him, so to speak?

For those of you who are interested - this edition, available from Litríoch, is bilingual Gáidhlig/Gaeilge and there was also a Gàidhlig/Scots edition published, but unfortunately that's become difficult to get hold of.


Well caidé = cad é if that helps any. Also, racadh is the conditional, not the subjunctive, though it still mgiht be a spelling error.


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PostPosted: Sun 21 Dec 2014 3:30 pm 
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Caidé = cad é = what

Cáide = cá fhad = how long


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PostPosted: Sun 21 Dec 2014 4:10 pm 
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Go raibh maith agaibh.
Sorry I should have said conditional (an modh coinníollach) for - rachadh, rather than the subjunctive, but is it a spelling mistake or does it make sense to put it there the first time round?


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PostPosted: Sun 21 Dec 2014 6:41 pm 
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I don't know the rest of it, but I can see it making sense.

Quote:
Chuaigh Biorachán Beag le slat a fháil,
slat a rachadh ar Bhiorachán Mór
ionas nach n-íosfadh sé tuilleadh de na cnóanna.


I'd say so, because the conditional is also used again later. Seems to me the story is about a small cockboat wanting to become a big one?


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PostPosted: Sun 21 Dec 2014 7:55 pm 
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Yes, "caidé"- also "goidé" - are the written forms of the Donegal pronunciation of "cad é".


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PostPosted: Sun 21 Dec 2014 8:13 pm 
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The story starts like this

Lá amháin, chuaigh Biorachán Beag agus Biorachán Mór le cnóanna a bhaint, ach mar a bhaineadh Biorachán Beag, d'íosfadh Biorachán Mór.

Chuaigh Biorachán Beag le slat a fháil,
slat a rachadh ar Bhiorachán Mór
ionas nach n-íosfadh sé tuilleadh de na cnóanna.

"Tá mé ag iarraidh...

slat a rachaidh ar Bhiorachán Mór
ionas nach n-íosfadh sé tuilleadh
de na cnóanna."

"Ní bhfaighidh tú mise", arsa an t-slat,
"mura bhfaigheann tú tua a bhainfidh mé."
Chuaigh sé chuig an áit ina raibh an tua.

(and every time after that it's - slat a rachaidh ar Bhiorachán Mór)

.....
"Tá mé ag iarraidh....

sop a íosfaidh bó
bó a bhléanfaidh bainne
bainne a ólfaidh cat
cat a bheirfidh ar luch
luch a scríbfaidh im
im do chosa an mhadaidh
madadh a rithfidh fia
fia a shnámhfaidh uisce
uisce a fhliuchfaidh cloch
cloch a fhaobhróidh tua
tua a bhainfidh slat
slat a rachaidh ar Bhiorachán Mór
ionas nach n-íosfaidh se tuilleadh
de na cnóanna."

- and so on and so on until in the end when Biorachán Beag has managed to get everything they're asking for and gets them to do what he wants them to, he finally comes back with the stick to find that Biorachán Mór has eaten all the nuts.

Words such madadh and builbhín - (a small loaf?) would suggest to me that this is in Ulster Gaelic.


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PostPosted: Sun 21 Dec 2014 9:10 pm 
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I should have mentioned this -
a' Ghaeilge le Aonghas Lambkin a rinne an leagan Gaeilge - does anyone know of him?


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PostPosted: Thu 08 Jan 2015 11:36 am 
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Location: 91 - France
He's from Belfast.
Here's another question. Féar not only means grass but hay as well, which I find a bit puzzling. How do they know which is which? An important question when you have cattle to look after, I would have thought. It is true though, that in London there's Haymarket and in Edinburgh it's called Grassmarket. In this story they use the word sop - which I thought meant straw and then only a wisp or a handful of it.

"Cá bhfuil tú ag dul,"" arsa an sop.

"Tá mé ag iarraidh....

sop a íosfaidh bó
bó a bhléanfaidh bainne
bainne a ólfaidh cat
cat a bheirfidh ar luch
luch a scríobfaidh im
im do chosa an mhadaidh
madadh a rithfidh fia
fia a shnámhfaidh uisce
uisce a fhliuchfaidh cloch
cloch a fhaobhróidh tua
tua a bhainfidh slat
slat a rachaidh ar Bhiorachán Mór
ionas nach n-íosfaidh sé tuilleadh
de na cnóanna."

'Ní bhfaighidh tú mise," arsa an sop,
"mura bhfaigheann tú an gille stábla.."
Chuaigh sé chuig an áit ina raibh an gille stábla.

In Scots it's -

"Whaur are ye gaun?" said the hey.

"I'm seekin....

some hey for feed tae a coo
a coo tae gie some milk
some milk for a drink tae a cat
a cat tae nick a moose
a moose tae scart some butter
some butter for the luifs o a dug
a dug tae chase a deer
a deer tae swim some watter
some watter tae wat a stane
a stane tae sherp an aix
an aix tae sned a stick
a stick I can tak tae Big Tappietoorie
sar's he'll no eat ony mair
o the nits."

'Ye'll no get me." said the hey,
"gin ye dinna get the hey-man."
An awa he gaed tae the place whaur the hey-man wis.


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