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PostPosted: Wed 17 Dec 2014 3:07 am 
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Posts: 6
Hello everyone,

There's a song by Irish harpist and composer Toirdhealbhach Ó Cearbhalláin (Turlough O'Carolan) called Eleanor Plunkett, which I would like to include in my repertoire.

It has been recorded by Iarla Ó Lionáird. The lyrics were written by O'Carolan, but apparently he has never edited them with the music, so people just adapt the lyrics to the music their own way. That's what Iarla Ó Lionáird did and also harpist Caitríona Rowsome on her book with songs by O'Carolan.

I have found the lyrics on the internet and I also own Caitríona's book, so I have two versions. The problem is: I don't speak Irish and have no idea how to pronounce it. It's really hard to learn it from listening to Iarla's performances only. Some consonants sound like German consonants to my ear. I can hear some guttural sounds.

And so I would like to know if you could kindly write an IPA version of the lyrics so that I can try and pronounce it or maybe record an audio track while reading the lyrics.

I would be extremely grateful.

Here are the lyrics:

As found on the internet:

A Neilí an chúil chraobhaigh
Bhfuil do dhá shúil ar dhath
An fhéir ghlais
'S tú a' féachaint gach lá
Ar na bréag bhfuil mé a' rá
Tú ghoil na bhfear
O Ard Mhacha bréige
Fuair clú mhór ó Ghaolaibh
Le tréana do lámh

Gidh nach maireann ins an tír
Ach tú do'd chlann
A cheannsacht is a tsló (Here Iarla sings what's on the book: Ní isleóchainn mo ghlór)
Ní cuma liom cad deir led (He sings something different here)
Bhéilín mar an rós (And something different here as well)
Ach cead suí led' thaobh
Chun go mbeinn 's tú ag ól

Ach a cheannsacht chiuin chéilidh
Más léir leatsa 'n spórt
Ó ní bheidh tú gan ceol
Dá gcloisfinn uait scéala
Ghluaisfinn do 'd fhéachaint
A phéirlin an chúil bhreá
Le d' ghruadh ar dhath na gcaortha
Ós tú a fuair an bua
Thar na céadaibh de mhnaibh


Book version:

A Nellí an chúil chraobhaigh,
a bhfuil do dhá shúil ar dhath an fhéir ghlais
'S tú féachaint gach lá,
A's ní bréag a bhfuil mé a rádh,
Gur tú, a ghoil na bhfear, Ó Ardamacha bréige
Fuair clú mhór ó Ghaodhalaibh Le tréine do lámh

Gidh nach maireann insa tírsa ach thú do do ghaolta,
Ní isleóchainn mo ghlór
Dá gcloisinn uait sgéala
ghluaisfinn dod'fhéachaint, a phéirlín an chúil bhreágh,
Led' ghruaidh ar dhath na gcaora a A's thug tú buaidh arna céadaibh do mhnáibh


Here you can watch Iarla performing Eleanor Plunkett in two different situations:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lE0By5aGkF0

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HlQIvGCA8SU

Best regards


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PostPosted: Wed 17 Dec 2014 3:55 am 
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Joined: Sun 28 Aug 2011 8:29 pm
Posts: 2994
cabraldemello wrote:
Hello everyone,

There's a song by Irish harpist and composer Toirdhealbhach Ó Cearbhalláin (Turlough O'Carolan) called Eleanor Plunkett, which I would like to include in my repertoire.

It has been recorded by Iarla Ó Lionáird. The lyrics were written by O'Carolan, but apparently he has never edited them with the music, so people just adapt the lyrics to the music their own way. That's what Iarla Ó Lionáird did and also harpist Caitríona Rowsome on her book with songs by O'Carolan.

I have found the lyrics on the internet and I also own Caitríona's book, so I have two versions. The problem is: I don't speak Irish and have no idea how to pronounce it. It's really hard to learn it from listening to Iarla's performances only. Some consonants sound like German consonants to my ear. I can hear some guttural sounds.

And so I would like to know if you could kindly write an IPA version of the lyrics so that I can try and pronounce it or maybe record an audio track while reading the lyrics.

I would be extremely grateful.

Here are the lyrics:

As found on the internet:

A Neilí an chúil chraobhaigh
Bhfuil do dhá shúil ar dhath
An fhéir ghlais
'S tú a' féachaint gach lá
Ar na bréag bhfuil mé a' rá
Tú ghoil na bhfear
O Ard Mhacha bréige
Fuair clú mhór ó Ghaolaibh
Le tréana do lámh

Gidh nach maireann ins an tír
Ach tú do'd chlann
A cheannsacht is a tsló (Here Iarla sings what's on the book: Ní isleóchainn mo ghlór)
Ní cuma liom cad deir led (He sings something different here)
Bhéilín mar an rós (And something different here as well)
Ach cead suí led' thaobh
Chun go mbeinn 's tú ag ól

Ach a cheannsacht chiuin chéilidh
Más léir leatsa 'n spórt
Ó ní bheidh tú gan ceol
Dá gcloisfinn uait scéala
Ghluaisfinn do 'd fhéachaint
A phéirlin an chúil bhreá
Le d' ghruadh ar dhath na gcaortha
Ós tú a fuair an bua
Thar na céadaibh de mhnaibh


Book version:

A Nellí an chúil chraobhaigh,
a bhfuil do dhá shúil ar dhath an fhéir ghlais
'S tú féachaint gach lá,
A's ní bréag a bhfuil mé a rádh,
Gur tú, a ghoil na bhfear, Ó Ardamacha bréige
Fuair clú mhór ó Ghaodhalaibh Le tréine do lámh

Gidh nach maireann insa tírsa ach thú do do ghaolta,
Ní isleóchainn mo ghlór
Dá gcloisinn uait sgéala
ghluaisfinn dod'fhéachaint, a phéirlín an chúil bhreágh,
Led' ghruaidh ar dhath na gcaora a A's thug tú buaidh arna céadaibh do mhnáibh


Here you can watch Iarla performing Eleanor Plunkett in two different situations:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lE0By5aGkF0

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HlQIvGCA8SU

Best regards


I think you are just missing a line here (where you say he's singing something different he's not) -
But I could be wrong.


Gidh nach maireann ins an tír
Ach tú do'd chlann
Ní isleóchainn mo ghlór
dó aon neach dá bhfuil beo
A cheannsacht is a tsló
Ní cuma liom cad deir led
Bhéilín mar an rós
Ach cead suí led' thaobh
Chun go mbeinn 's tú ag ól



Yes, Irish has guttural sounds very similar to German.

If I did an audio of it I'd only confuse you more as he has a different dialect to mine. Anyhow the voice is a bit rusty at the moment :)


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PostPosted: Wed 17 Dec 2014 4:23 am 
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Joined: Wed 17 Dec 2014 2:21 am
Posts: 6
Hello!

Many thanks for replying and for correcting the lyrics.

Do you know what his dialect is called?

I hope someone who speaks it is able to help me here then.

Once again, many thanks for your help! :D


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PostPosted: Wed 17 Dec 2014 4:55 am 
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Joined: Wed 17 Dec 2014 2:21 am
Posts: 6
The studio version is also available on Spotify:

https://open.spotify.com/user/colmbrack ... ylaubNjF13

In case you'd like to listen to it. =]


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PostPosted: Wed 17 Dec 2014 5:31 am 
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Joined: Sun 28 Aug 2011 8:29 pm
Posts: 2994
He's a Munster man.


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PostPosted: Wed 17 Dec 2014 4:40 pm 
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Joined: Thu 01 Sep 2011 9:55 am
Posts: 2114
Location: 91 - France
Isn't this the music score here?

http://www.oldmusicproject.com/ - Eleanor Plunkett - taken from The Complete Works of Turlough O'Carolan


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PostPosted: Wed 17 Dec 2014 5:32 pm 
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Joined: Sun 04 Sep 2011 11:02 pm
Posts: 1581
The two versions you have are essentially the same, except that your book version has as its second verse parts of the second and third verses from the internet version, as shown below (color coordinated). Many of the apparent differences in wording have to do with older spelling forms or dialectical forms:

Internet version - verses 2 and 3 (with Bríd's corrections):

Gidh nach maireann ins an tír
ach tú do’d chlann.
Ní isleóchainn mo ghlór,

dó aon neach dá bhfuil beo,
a cheannsacht is a tsló.
Ní cuma liom cad deir led
bhéilín mar an rós,
ach cead suí led’ thaobh,
chun go mbeinn ‘s tú ag ól.

Ach a cheannsacht chiuin chéilidh,
más léir leatsa ‘n spórt.
Ó ní bheidh tú gan ceol
dá gcloisfinn uait scéala.
Ghluaisfinn do ‘d fhéachaint,
a phéirlin an chúil bhreá,
le d’ ghruadh ar dhath na gcaortha,
ós tú a fuair an bua,
thar na céadaibh de mhnaibh.


Book version - verse 2:

Gidh nach maireann insa tírsa
ach thú do do ghaolta.
Ní isleóchainn mo ghlór,

dá gcloisinn uait sgéala.
Ghluaisfinn dod'fhéachaint,
a phéirlín an chúil bhreágh,
led' ghruaidh ar dhath na gcaora,
a's thug tú buaidh
arna céadaibh do mhnáibh.

_________________
I'm not a native (or entirely fluent) speaker, so be sure to wait for confirmations/corrections, especially for tattoos.


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PostPosted: Wed 17 Dec 2014 9:43 pm 
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Joined: Mon 18 Aug 2014 4:29 pm
Posts: 67
Location: NSW Australia
It needs the "ancroiait" website treatment where:
Line 1: Correct Irish lyric
Line 2: approximate phonetic sound
Line 3: word for word translation
Line 4: translation
Note: things to learn from this line

I do love their treatment of The Cup Song and Wake Me Up - it does help a bit to echo or try to echo the singers - and I haven't a clue which dialect they are in. At my very beginner stage it just feels nice to join in making the sounds so that it is not so foreign to my ears.

This could be a good challenge for the new year - just suggesting.

Happy New Year
JulieA :hide:


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PostPosted: Thu 18 Dec 2014 1:24 am 
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Joined: Wed 17 Dec 2014 2:21 am
Posts: 6
franc 91 wrote:
Isn't this the music score here?

http://www.oldmusicproject.com/ - Eleanor Plunkett - taken from The Complete Works of Turlough O'Carolan


Yes, it is, Franc.

Caitríona's book has the lyrics written next to the music though. Her own adaptation.


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PostPosted: Thu 18 Dec 2014 1:32 am 
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Joined: Wed 17 Dec 2014 2:21 am
Posts: 6
CaoimhínSF wrote:
The two versions you have are essentially the same, except that your book version has as its second verse parts of the second and third verses from the internet version, as shown below (color coordinated). Many of the apparent differences in wording have to do with older spelling forms or dialectical forms:

Internet version - verses 2 and 3 (with Bríd's corrections):

Gidh nach maireann ins an tír
ach tú do’d chlann.
Ní isleóchainn mo ghlór,

dó aon neach dá bhfuil beo,
a cheannsacht is a tsló.
Ní cuma liom cad deir led
bhéilín mar an rós,
ach cead suí led’ thaobh,
chun go mbeinn ‘s tú ag ól.

Ach a cheannsacht chiuin chéilidh,
más léir leatsa ‘n spórt.
Ó ní bheidh tú gan ceol
dá gcloisfinn uait scéala.
Ghluaisfinn do ‘d fhéachaint,
a phéirlin an chúil bhreá,
le d’ ghruadh ar dhath na gcaortha,
ós tú a fuair an bua,
thar na céadaibh de mhnaibh.


Book version - verse 2:

Gidh nach maireann insa tírsa
ach thú do do ghaolta.
Ní isleóchainn mo ghlór,

dá gcloisinn uait sgéala.
Ghluaisfinn dod'fhéachaint,
a phéirlín an chúil bhreágh,
led' ghruaidh ar dhath na gcaora,
a's thug tú buaidh
arna céadaibh do mhnáibh.


You're right! Many thanks for pointing this!


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