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PostPosted: Fri 27 Dec 2013 10:49 am 
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Lughaidh wrote:
but you have to teach what an urú is, and to make your pupils pronounce "ng" at the beginning of a word, something that even many teachers don't manage to do (many use an "n" instead: Dún na Nall" etc..., my old teacher told us many non-native speakers say Dún na nDall (the fortress of the blind) instead of "Dún na nGall" because they don't manage to pronounce ng at the beginning of a word (well, it's easy though...)

That's interesting, I would have thought this would be easy for Hiberno-English speakers. I have broad (velarized) ng at the end of stung for example, although speakers of other English dialects wouldn't.

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PostPosted: Fri 27 Dec 2013 11:31 am 
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It's harder for people to pronounce sounds in positions they are not used to, that's why 'tsunami' is usually pronounced 'sunami' even tho English speakers regularly produce 'ts' in whats, cats, lots etc

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PostPosted: Fri 27 Dec 2013 6:51 pm 
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The way the Japanese say it -
津波 http://www.forvo.com/word/%E6%B4%A5%E6%B3%A2/#ja

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It is recommended that you always wait for three to agree on a translation.
I speak Connemara Irish, and my input will often reflect that.
I will do an mp3 file on request for short translations.

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PostPosted: Sat 28 Dec 2013 1:04 am 
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Quote:
That's interesting, I would have thought this would be easy for Hiberno-English speakers. I have broad (velarized) ng at the end of stung for example, although speakers of other English dialects wouldn't.


but pronouncing it at the beginning of a word is something different. Using a sound that exists in your language but in a context where it doesn't exist in your language, makes it difficult.

Many French people have difficulty to pronounce the broad ch sound (when learning German or Spanish), although that sound exists in French as an allophone of r after an unvoiced consonant: "lettre", "âcre" etc... So, they are able to pronounce it, but when they have to use it between 2 vowels or at the beginning of a word, they don't manage anymore...

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PostPosted: Sat 28 Dec 2013 6:11 pm 
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The 'aesthetics of identity' play in to it too -even if people can speak one way (and notice how many can imitate an accent perfectly but then can speak in it when being serious) they may not feel comfortable using it in a different context

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PostPosted: Mon 06 Jan 2014 8:07 pm 
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Lughaidh wrote:
Quote:
Students rarely have major trouble with the likes of "i mBaile Átha Cliath"
except to pronounce "Baile" maybe, most non-native speakers say "baille" (with a ly-sound, which is wrong) instead of "baile"... even many teachers.

And most native speakers (in Connemara at least) say Bleá Cliath /ˌb´l´ɑ: 'k´l´i:ə/, rather than Baile Átha Cliath anyway. :winkgrin:

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My "specialty" is Connemara Irish, particularly Cois Fhairrge dialect, but I can also speak Ulster and Munster Irish with native-level pronunciation.
Is fearr Gaeilge ḃriste ná Béarla cliste, cinnte, aċ i ḃfad níos fearr aríst í Gaeilge ḃinn ḃeo na nGaeltaċtaí.
Gaeilge Chonnacht (GC), go háraid Gaeilge Chois Fhairrge (GCF), Gaeilic Uladh (GU), Gaelainn na Mumhan (GM), agus Gaeilge an Chaighdeáin Oifigiúil (CO).


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PostPosted: Mon 06 Jan 2014 8:11 pm 
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Breandán wrote:
And most native speakers (in Connemara at least) say Bleá Cliath /ˌb´l´ɑ: 'k´l´i:ə/, rather than Baile Átha Cliath anyway.
I think that's what most people say, particularly if it's in a sentence and not just a stand alone name. :yes: I'm sure kids must wonder where the flower is!

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