I agree with Breandán

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It is recommended that you always wait for three to agree on a translation.
I speak Connemara Irish, and my input will often reflect that.
I will do an mp3 file on request for short translations.
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I also agree with Breandán's comment.

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Bí cinnte de go nglacfaidh triúr le gach aistriúchán a thabharfar.
Be sure to get three in agreement with a translation given.

A chairde,

I am an ex member who has returned. I know primarily standard Irish. I recognise that real dialectal Irish is far preferable to any artificial standard. I also know that in the Gaeltachtaí I have been in I have heard Béarlachas posing as Irish among so-called native speakers. Who am I to fault them - that is the way Irish has gone...until eventually it is no longer recognisable as Irish and then we'll have another debate.

I can have a reasonable conversation with native speakers from any of the three main dialects. They will understand me and I will understand most of what they are saying if they are tolerant of me and speak at a reasonable pace, like any native speaker, of French, for example, which I have a certain knowledge of. In fact, my understanding of dialectal Irish when spoken at normal pace is pretty good.

In looking back over my experience of learning Irish over forty years, it is only on sites like this that I have encountered negativity. The site itself is not at fault and is a great facility. Even on the Aran Islands where I was excusing myself for having 'Gaeilge na leabhar' only, I was heartened by a native man who said that people like me who had a real interest in learning and speaking the language were the only hope for the language.

So, while I admire those who have a knowledge of historical Irish, or purists who are not even from this country, I am more inclined to engage in dialogue with those who are involved with the language daily in the real world whether they be native speakers or not. In the real world, I never encounter the bitterness or one-upmanship which I encounter online. Indeed, the arguments I have had with others over the years might never have happened in the real world. In real life, what I find is a mutual admiration for all those who promote the language regardless of their ability. Healthy discussion is good, of course but remember, pretty much everyone who visits this site has an interest in Irish. Good luck to them all!

I particularly like the "Even on the Aran Islands where I was excusing myself for having 'Gaeilge na leabhar' only, I was heartened by a native man who said that people like me who had a real interest in learning and speaking the language were the only hope for the language."
That says it all.

(In general the Aran people are the finest of folk.)

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Bí cinnte de go nglacfaidh triúr le gach aistriúchán a thabharfar.
Be sure to get three in agreement with a translation given.

I also agree with this

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Tá mise ag teacht le Breandán ar an scéal seo comh maith. Dar liom go bhfuil neart spáis anseo d'achan duine, achan bharúil, agus ar ndóigh, achan chanamhaint. Níl ann ach go gcaithfidh muid labhairt le chéile go hurramach, rud a ndéantar cheanna féin don chuid is mó.

Bonnes fêtes a tous!

Domhnall

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Ultach mé agus Gaeilg Uladh a labhraim go measardha maith!

And I love endless nesting of previous posts...



And that my friends is why Irish is dying -everyone is trying to be nice to one another. A friend of mine who lived in Spain, told we once how the native speakers of English he knew would be in competition with each other to have the best Spanish, for social esteem demanded it of them for how would they chat up a beautiful young lady without it?

If you want to know how Korea got to be where it is today, coming from nothing, it not really down to 'hard work' as much as interpersonal jealousy; you get up in the morning and go to work so the next lad won't edge you out of line

The problem with Irish is that everyone is admitted to the table and let feast and given a clap on the back for even sitting down, yet there is no real gain in the end as it's an empty meal. It would be much better if it were on a mountain and you had to climb yet once there there was great prestige or gain. In the real world thought, be you native, purist or other, there is little real gain to studying or using it so it gets put into a niche where everyone is just happy you came along

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__̴ı̴̴̡̡̡ ̡͌l̡̡̡ ̡͌l̡*̡̡ ̴̡ı̴̴̡ ̡̡͡|̲̲̲͡͡͡ ̲▫̲͡ ̲̲̲͡͡π̲̲͡͡ ̲̲͡▫̲̲͡͡ ̲|̡̡̡ ̡ ̴̡ı̴̡̡ ̡͌l̡̡̡̡.___

I should have read the whole thread - which I didn't! I would have seen the reference to 'unacknowledged extremism that hides behind what ostensibly is the 'middle ground''

To me that is a really odd way of looking at things which turns logic on its head. The extremism of not being extreme, eh? Nobody wants to sell the language short, at least I don't. But it costs nothing to encourage those who want to learn. Making the language the preserve of an elite few is not the way forward in my opinion.

On the other hand, I am not at all happy with the dire effort at Irish I hear on the radio each evening - I can't remember what station, but it is a token effort at having a few minutes of Irish (announcements about events etc.) and the English intonation in the Irish sentences and the basic grammar errors make me cringe!

So, I'm all for the 'middle ground'. It depends how you define it of course. The middle ground I refer to is one of tolerance which encourages people to embrace the language but in doing so there is an expectation that people will aim towards authenticity i.e. learning a proper dialect. Even there, there is a problem. Not everyone has the time to spend living in a Gaeltacht area in order to learn a proper dialect. As I mentioned before, I have spent 40 years learning the language, and I have a lot more to learn. The truth is that I have a bit of a mixture of dialects but more of a Munster dialect over all. I certainly would like to have one pure dialect but that isn't likely to happen any time soon. Still, no-one is going to tell me that I shouldn't speak Irish because it is not perfect, and if they do, who cares - they can have their extreme opinions. They rarely exist in the real world I inhabit, thank God.

It's easy to pronounce Irish correctly but it's not done because people are attached to the speech aesthetics of their own cohort and don't feel comfortable pronouncing another language as would a native. It also doesn't help that people believe the Irish accent comes from Irish so that means they can speak An Gaeilg immediately and perfectly or that Ireland is full to the brim with snobbery so the language does the job of putting the English-speaking plebes at a disadvantage while shutting out the boggers on the west coast

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__̴ı̴̴̡̡̡ ̡͌l̡̡̡ ̡͌l̡*̡̡ ̴̡ı̴̴̡ ̡̡͡|̲̲̲͡͡͡ ̲▫̲͡ ̲̲̲͡͡π̲̲͡͡ ̲̲͡▫̲̲͡͡ ̲|̡̡̡ ̡ ̴̡ı̴̡̡ ̡͌l̡̡̡̡.___

God I wouldn't agree there, Ive been trying very hard for a good few years and Im still falling short of the mark, wouldn't say its easy.

The Irish accent does come from Irish, but the longer a particular area has been Irish speaking the less influence it seems to have. For example look at the change of accents in Dublin in the space of one or two generations. Accents like those held by members of the Dubliners band young working class people are very different.

Perhaps people are not aware of how much their accents are changing , this guy probably wouldn't have to modify his pronunciation at all to speak Irish correctly http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IK59frWIkwg
but very few sound like him anymore.

As for those snobby people who speak Irish to exude others, while they do exist ive often found them a minority. whether they speak Irish or not they are still likely to be snobby arseholes best avoided.

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Bíonn rudaí maithe mall