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PostPosted: Thu 04 Apr 2013 9:27 pm 
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'glórach' and 'torannach' came up on another thread viewtopic.php?f=28&t=2080&start=10 I am just wondering if there is any difference in when they are used? Is there different kinds of noise in question?

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PostPosted: Thu 04 Apr 2013 9:41 pm 
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From what I can tell browsing citations, glórach can generally be interpreted as "vocal" or "vociferous" and torannach as "thunderous" without altering the meaning. For instance, from Merriman's Cúirt an Mhéan-Oíche: "gorm na dtonn / ag teacht go tolgach torannach trom". And from Pearse's Bean sléibhe ag caoineadh a mac: "Do labhair an naosc binn 's an crotach glórach". Glórach also appears to be the more general term; it's certainly more common.


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PostPosted: Thu 04 Apr 2013 11:20 pm 
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Maybe Lughaidh can comment on this one, but I seem to remember the word "callánach" in Donegal for "noisy", but I can't remember
if I really heard it or it was just something I read. And it seems like it had the emphasis/accent on the first syllable. I'd appreciate his thoughts.


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PostPosted: Fri 05 Apr 2013 2:53 am 
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Féabar wrote:
Maybe Lughaidh can comment on this one, but I seem to remember the word "callánach" in Donegal for "noisy", but I can't remember if I really heard it or it was just something I read. And it seems like it had the emphasis/accent on the first syllable.

I thought all words had the accent on the first syllable in Donegal (except of course for the obvious exceptions like aniogh and amuigh).

According to my sources, callánach is Standard as well. I also found tormánach (from tormán "a resounding noise") and gleoch (from gleo "battle;tumult")--not to be confused with gleorach "sparkling". And if that was confusing enough, there's also gleoránach, from gleorán "discordant noise" (which seems to show up most commonly in gealbhan gleoránach "noisy sparrow", a name for the chaffinch).


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PostPosted: Fri 05 Apr 2013 3:24 am 
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Domhnaillín Breac wrote:
Féabar wrote:
Maybe Lughaidh can comment on this one, but I seem to remember the word "callánach" in Donegal for "noisy", but I can't remember if I really heard it or it was just something I read. And it seems like it had the emphasis/accent on the first syllable.

I thought all words had the accent on the first syllable in Donegal (except of course for the obvious exceptions like aniogh and amuigh).

According to my sources, callánach is Standard as well. I also found tormánach (from tormán "a resounding noise") and gleoch (from gleo "battle;tumult")--not to be confused with gleorach "sparkling". And if that was confusing enough, there's also gleoránach, from gleorán "discordant noise" (which seems to show up most commonly in gealbhan gleoránach "noisy sparrow", a name for the chaffinch).


You're right that the general rule in Donegal is first syllable emphasis, but I feel better knowing for sure how an actual native speaker would say it and if it is indeed the word generally used. Seems I heard a teacher in Gleann Fhinne saying it, but I just want to be sure. I've been reading so many short novels that I'm beginning to blur what I learned in Donegal and what I continue to pick up in my learning. Thanks for the response.


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PostPosted: Fri 05 Apr 2013 10:02 am 
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Féabar wrote:
Maybe Lughaidh can comment on this one, but I seem to remember the word "callánach" in Donegal for "noisy", but I can't remember
if I really heard it or it was just something I read. And it seems like it had the emphasis/accent on the first syllable. I'd appreciate his thoughts.


Callánach is definitely the preferred word in Donegal, at least in the spoken language. Glórach and tormánach are words that appear in Donegal literature fairly regularly - I'm reading 'Mo Bhealach Féin" at the moment and I've come across both on a few occasions. I think Domhnaillín's comments on how they're used make sense, although you see them used pretty interchangeably in literature, sometimes depending on alliterative effects etc. I'm not sure, but I don't think torannach is too common in Donegal.

Féabar, perhaps you know this, but there is an excellent resource if ever you're unsure of an Ulster word - Tobar na Gaedhilge is a searchable corpus of mostly Donegal literature. Unfortunately I can't get it to work on my Linux machine, but I try to use it on other people's computers from time to time.

Sorry Saoirse, this isn't too much help as far as your original question is concerned!

Domhnall

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PostPosted: Fri 05 Apr 2013 10:12 am 
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AnBraonach wrote:
Sorry Saoirse, this isn't too much help as far as your original question is concerned!
As long as everyone is having a good time....! :party:

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PostPosted: Fri 05 Apr 2013 1:21 pm 
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AnBraonach wrote:
Féabar wrote:
Maybe Lughaidh can comment on this one, but I seem to remember the word "callánach" in Donegal for "noisy", but I can't remember
if I really heard it or it was just something I read. And it seems like it had the emphasis/accent on the first syllable. I'd appreciate his thoughts.


Callánach is definitely the preferred word in Donegal, at least in the spoken language. Glórach and tormánach are words that appear in Donegal literature fairly regularly - I'm reading 'Mo Bhealach Féin" at the moment and I've come across both on a few occasions. I think Domhnaillín's comments on how they're used make sense, although you see them used pretty interchangeably in literature, sometimes depending on alliterative effects etc. I'm not sure, but I don't think torannach is too common in Donegal.

Féabar, perhaps you know this, but there is an excellent resource if ever you're unsure of an Ulster word - Tobar na Gaedhilge is a searchable corpus of mostly Donegal literature. Unfortunately I can't get it to work on my Linux machine, but I try to use it on other people's computers from time to time.

Sorry Saoirse, this isn't too much help as far as your original question is concerned!

Domhnall



AnBraonach:

Níor chuala mé riamh faoin achmainn sin. Go raibh mile maith agat! Is dócha go bhfuil sé an chuideach, agus is é rud iontach suimiúil dom.

Ag obair liom,
Féabar
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PostPosted: Fri 05 Apr 2013 4:24 pm 
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Domhnaillín Breac wrote:
From what I can tell browsing citations, glórach can generally be interpreted as "vocal" or "vociferous" and torannach as "thunderous" without altering the meaning. For instance, from Merriman's Cúirt an Mhéan-Oíche: "gorm na dtonn / ag teacht go tolgach torannach trom". And from Pearse's Bean sléibhe ag caoineadh a mac: "Do labhair an naosc binn 's an crotach glórach". Glórach also appears to be the more general term; it's certainly more common.



I think "glórach" applies to the voice "vocal". And sometimes used figuratively to animate objects - Éist le glór na hAbhann - (ok maybe animate is not the word to use with a river :S )
Torannach - is noisily.

Personally I've never heard "torannach" used. Maybe it's more for poetic use.
I use the noun "torann".
Céard é an torann sin?
Tá torann aisteach as an n-innéal sin. srl.

A bit timely, this was posted today -
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uXYWGyje ... ploademail

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PostPosted: Sat 06 Apr 2013 8:38 am 
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I can't vouch for the current usage, but although FGB just has "noisy" for torannach, Dinneen (1927) has "loud sounding, rumbling, arrogant". (An older Dinneen (1904) had only "heavy rolling (of waves)" :dhera: )

For glórach, Dinneen (1927) has "voiceful, harmonious; clamourous, noisy".

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