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 Post subject: Re: 'cac' = sh*t or poo?
PostPosted: Fri 06 Apr 2012 7:59 pm 
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Redwolf wrote:
These euphemisms in English stem from how the language came to be.

I am fully cognizant of their origins, but that knowledge does little to negate my inherent dislike of them. I find them pretentious (actually, I find the whole distinction between "classes" pretentious). And the ones resulting from "political correctness" have taken things to such absurd extremes that perfectly serviceable words such as "deaf" and "retarded" and "crippled" which, by definition, are not at all derogatory, are perceived as such. Thankfully, some of them lose their stigma over time; you no longer commonly hear "in the family way" in lieu of "pregnant" but new ones keep cropping up. Just what is so vulgar about "toilet paper" that it is labeled "bathroom tissue"? The whole concept of needing different terminologies to refer to the same things strikes me as ludicrous. But perhaps I haven't enough blue blood to understand it properly! :LOL:

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 Post subject: Re: 'cac' = sh*t or poo?
PostPosted: Fri 06 Apr 2012 8:28 pm 
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Just to really throw things off topic: A while ago I heard an interview on the radio with an author who wrote a history of swear words (wish I could remember his name or book title now). But anyway, he divided it into 3 phases.

Phase 1: Taking the lord's name in vein, or talking frivolously about hell, damnation etc. were all very much taboo in medieval times.

Phase 2: In Victorian times, it became more acceptable to joke or speculate about God and spirituality, but anything to do with bodily functions was off limits.

Phase 3: Nowadays, words to do with the human body are much more acceptable. But don't even think about using words that discriminate against people based on their race, gender or sexual preference.

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 Post subject: Re: 'cac' = sh*t or poo?
PostPosted: Fri 06 Apr 2012 11:22 pm 
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Lughaidh wrote:
Quote:
It's because the French-derived words came to be associated with the upper classes, who were generally the ones who could afford to eat the animal, whereas the Saxon-derived words came to be associated with the animal itself. The French terms were considered more cultured. So the peasants raised "cows" and the masters ate "beef."


I know, but why? The upper classes may have used the same words... and in other languages (well, those I know), people use the same words for living animals and for meat.
For instance, in Brittany the nobility would speak French and everybody else would speak Breton, and in Breton we use the same words for living animals and for meat, we just add the word "kig" (meat) before - just as we add "(f)eoil" in Irish (caoireoil, mairteoil, muiceoil...)


I don't know, Lughaidh...there's not a lot of rhyme or reason to it. I suspect it partially has to do with the fact that it did eventually become one language, so things just got put together piecemeal.

An interesting thing about Caoimhín's observation of "amand" vs. "almond" is that California may spell it the French way for the fruit on the tree, but we don't pronounce it the French way. In the Central Valley, where almonds are grown, they say "A-mund" (emphasis on the "A," which is pronounced like the "a" in "cat"). When I asked my relatives in Merced once why they left the "l" out, they said "it's because when they harvest the nuts, they knock the 'ell out of them!" :darklaugh: Funny, I hadn't put that together with the French spelling before!

Redwolf


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 Post subject: Re: 'cac' = sh*t or poo?
PostPosted: Fri 06 Apr 2012 11:26 pm 
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Quote:
An interesting thing about Caoimhín's observation of "amand" vs. "almond" is that California may spell it the French way for the fruit on the tree, but we don't pronounce it the French way. In the Central Valley, where almonds are grown, they say "A-mund" (emphasis on the "A," which is pronounced like the "a" in "cat"). When I asked my relatives in Merced once why they left the "l" out, they said "it's because when they harvest the nuts, they knock the 'ell out of them!" :darklaugh: Funny, I hadn't put that together with the French spelling before!


aye, in French it's "amande", pronounced [aˈmɑ͂d].


Quote:
I am fully cognizant of their origins, but that knowledge does little to negate my inherent dislike of them. I find them pretentious (actually, I find the whole distinction between "classes" pretentious). And the ones resulting from "political correctness" have taken things to such absurd extremes that perfectly serviceable words such as "deaf" and "retarded" and "crippled" which, by definition, are not at all derogatory, are perceived as such. Thankfully, some of them lose their stigma over time; you no longer commonly hear "in the family way" in lieu of "pregnant" but new ones keep cropping up. Just what is so vulgar about "toilet paper" that it is labeled "bathroom tissue"? The whole concept of needing different terminologies to refer to the same things strikes me as ludicrous. But perhaps I haven't enough blue blood to understand it properly!


that does exist in French as well. I find that ridiculous.
In "politically correct speech", people use euphemistic (?) words like "non-voyant" (non-seeing?) to say "aveugle" (blind) or "personne à mobilité réduite" (person with limited mobility?) to say "handicapé" (disabled), while blind people and disabled people don't even use these and find them ridiculous and use the "normal" words...
So far I never heard such words to say pregnant and toilet paper though :darklaugh: In everyday speech, many people use the abbreviation "PQ" for "papier cul" ("arse paper") :-) but it's the contrary of "politically correct speech" :darklaugh:
In Breton there are euphemisms to say "pregnant" though: people say a woman is "carrying" or that "there are news with her" :)

But we are kind off-topic now :)

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 Post subject: Re: 'cac' = sh*t or poo?
PostPosted: Fri 06 Apr 2012 11:53 pm 
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Just like the other place...you never know where a topic is going to go!

Americans are notoriously squeamish about saying the word "toilet." We don't go to the "toilet," we go to the "restroom" or the "bathroom" or the "ladies'/mens' room" or even (for women) to the "powder room." Sometimes we go to the "lavatory." But never to the toilet. We had to train all those kids we took to London in 2005 to ask for the "toilet," because asking for the "restroom" just got them blank looks.

My new next door neighbor has taken to yelling at her dog (named "Puddles") to "go potty!" at about 6:15 every morning. As her back porch is just a few feet from my bedroom window, this, of course, usually wakes me up. I'm very tempted one of these mornings to yell back at her "for Crissake...she's a dog. She doesn't use a 'potty.' Just tell her to take a shit and be done with it!"

Redwolf


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 Post subject: Re: 'cac' = sh*t or poo?
PostPosted: Fri 06 Apr 2012 11:56 pm 
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FFS your neighbour just need to open the door and to put his dog out and I guess she'll understand, your neighbour doesn't need to yell anything... :)

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 Post subject: Re: 'cac' = sh*t or poo?
PostPosted: Sat 07 Apr 2012 12:03 am 
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Lughaidh wrote:
FFS your neighbour just need to open the door and to put his dog out and I guess she'll understand, your neighbour doesn't need to yell anything... :)


Yeah...dogs are kind of born knowing how to do that. ;)

Or she could do what most responsible dog owners do and put a leash on the poor animal and take her for a walk. I don't think the poor creature ever goes anywhere but the house and the back yard.

Redwolf


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 Post subject: Re: 'cac' = sh*t or poo?
PostPosted: Sat 07 Apr 2012 12:35 am 
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Location: Hamilton, NJ, USA
A Lughaidh, it's nice to know it's not just this country! :D

Redwolf wrote:
My new next door neighbor has taken to yelling at her dog (named "Puddles") to "go potty!" at about 6:15 every morning. As her back porch is just a few feet from my bedroom window, this, of course, usually wakes me up. I'm very tempted one of these mornings to yell back at her "for Crissake...she's a dog. She doesn't use a 'potty.' Just tell her to take a shit and be done with it!"

:rofl:

When I was housebreaking Saoirse (my dog, not our friend on the forum) I would repeat the word "leithreas" while she was eliminating, so that should I ever be pressed for time I could just tell her "leithreas" and she would know what I expected. It worked quite well, too. One morning I was carrying her outside, and before we got to the back door, I made the mistake of asking her if she needed to go "leithreas." I never made that particular mistake again. :no:

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Táim ag foghlaim Gaelainn na Mumhan

Tá fáilte roim nach aon cheartú!
I am a learner. Any translations offered are practice and should not be used unless confirmed.


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 Post subject: Re: 'cac' = sh*t or poo?
PostPosted: Sat 07 Apr 2012 12:39 am 
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Aislingeach wrote:
When I was housebreaking Saoirse (my dog, not our friend on the forum

Thanks for that clarification! :oops:

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 Post subject: Re: 'cac' = sh*t or poo?
PostPosted: Sat 07 Apr 2012 3:17 am 
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Location: Ann Arbor
I taught my kids by asking if they needed to have a bowel movement. Of course, I taught scapula, sternum, femur, etc. They killed the anatomy part of their A&P class.

What can I say, that is the nurse in me. :LOL:

Sass


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