In doing my Talk Irish online language lessons, I encountered the sentence "Rinne mamaí an tae ar a ceathair a chlog."

The audio gives a pronunciation of "ceathair" that I am hearing roughly as kire (i.e., like English "kite," but with an r instead of a t). I played it at least seven times to be sure.

Then I went to Forvo and listened to the two pronunciations there (http://www.forvo.com/word/ceathair/#ga), which sound different from each other and also different from the Talk Irish pronunciation. I don't suppose these pronunciations reflect the three main dialects of Irish I have read about? There are differences in both the middle of the word and the end...

Can I really be hearing something like kire in the Talk Irish sentence? In other words, the th doesn't need to get any sound at all? Is the (non)pronunciation of the th affected by the context--such as the adjacent "a chlog"?

Not pronouncing the th may happen when the speaker speaks quickly, and it is also normal in certain dialects, especially that of Cois Fhairrge, in Connemara.
I've tried to record the northwestern Donegal pronunciation (with the th pronounced) but Forvo site doesn't want to record it (some problem between my mic and the website but I don't know how to solve that, sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn't, I don't know why).

_________________
Is fearr Gaeilg na Gaeltaċta ná Gaeilg ar biṫ eile
Agus is í Gaeilg Ġaoṫ Doḃair is binne

Lughaidh, thank you! Too bad the Forvo recording didn't work; I would have liked to hear it.

I have repeatedly been amazed, throughout the Talk Irish lessons, at how few syllables are uttered per sentence relative to the number of syllables I THINK will be uttered when I first look at the text on the computer screen.

In a lot of cases, that can be due to syllables which were distinct from one another (long ago) merging into a diphthong, as in words like tabhair and leabhar. Just think about how archaic English spelling can be, and then think about the fact that Irish was a written language before there even was an English language. In the spelling reforms which took place in Irish in the 20th century, new (shorter) spellings were created for some of the diphthongs, and some letter combinations which had gone silent were dropped, sometimes with changes in the remaining letters (such as adding an accent. For example, compare the Irish oíche with the older form, still used in Scottish Gaelic: oidhche). Not all of the archaic spellings were changed, though ("archaic" in the sense that they are not directly phonetic now, although they are generally quite regular, once you get used to the letter combinations).

_________________
I'm not a native (or entirely fluent) speaker, so be sure to wait for confirmations/corrections, especially for tattoos.

Yes, I have been having the (reassuring) sense that there are regularities out there somewhere, but I guess the challenge is getting used to the letter combinations. At the moment it seems as though there are an awful lot of them. I'm guessing that patterns will become more conspicuous as I keep reading. It is already getting better.

I have to say, it IS kind of thrilling when I get it right! By the way, this feels almost like learning a new alphabet, since the sound-and-letter relationships are so different from English in many cases.

One thing you'll find, too, is the more you listen, the more these "shortened" pronunciations will make sense to you. Learning programs often start off with very clear, distinct, pronunciation, which is good when you're first starting to wrap your mind around the phonetic system, but that's not how people speak from day to day.

If you don't already, I really, really recommend listening to some Irish spoken at a natural pace every single day (TG4 is one option, or Raidió na Gaeltachta, both of which are available on-line). That really trains your ear. At first it will sound like a lot of random noise, with the odd recognizable word here and there ("agus" and "'sea" seem to be the ones that learners seem to recognize most quickly), but over time it will really pay off in terms of understanding regular day to day speech.

Redwolf

Thank you, Redwolf. Yes, I have those things on my list...but I must say, I don't much like to listen to natural-speed language until I know a LITTLE more than I do now. I get kind of frustrated otherwise. (I just began Irish on May 1.)

My impression is that the speech in the Talk Irish application is significantly closer to natural rhythms and speed than one usually gets in language-learning applications and audio lessons. It just doesn't seem to have that distinct syllable-by-syllable pronunciation I am accustomed to (especially at beginning levels). I am having to do a lot of replaying of things in order to match the sounds with the text--but it's kind of fun!

I feel as though I am solving a puzzle.

Perhaps I will come out of it sounding much, um, cooler than I have with other languages? I do love the sounds of Irish. They also seem pretty natural to my English-speaking mouth.

_________________
Brand new Irish learner inclined to ask questions. Writer, Words & Worlds of New York, a website about language-learning. http://www.ellenjovin.com

The recordings may not be as fast as you think. Irish speech kind of flows together so that a sentence sounds like one long word, which gives you the impression that people are speaking a lot faster than they really are. Native Irish speakers don't like to have any pauses or breaks in the middle of a sentence (in case someone else manages to get a word in )

"Duine eile ann" (anyone else there) is often pronounced "duin' eil' ann" so that you don't have to pause between vowel sounds.

"Ann riamh" (ever/never there) would be pronounced "ann ariamh" with an extra schwa vowel so that there is no pause between the consonants.

By the way Ellen, I've been looking at your site. You are one ambitious woman. Best of luck with your project.

_________________
Táim ag foghlaim fós. Fáilte roimh gach aon cheartúchán.

I think it's simply because in certain dialects the word for never is "ariamh" and not "riamh"
As far as I know, Irish doesn't add extra vowels at the beginning of words to make pronunciation easier.

_________________
Is fearr Gaeilg na Gaeltaċta ná Gaeilg ar biṫ eile
Agus is í Gaeilg Ġaoṫ Doḃair is binne

That's interesting Lughaidh. I didn't know "ariamh" was an alternative to "riamh."

Maybe I was wrong about a vowel being added to the beginning of a word, but you definitely get extra vowels in the middle of a word, e.g. ainm is pronounced "ainim." I wonder why people don't just spell it "ainim."

_________________
Táim ag foghlaim fós. Fáilte roimh gach aon cheartúchán.