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PostPosted: Mon 14 Jan 2013 3:42 am 
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Hello All,

I just read that last year, the official standard of Irish was revised? what does this mean in the long run? Do we all have to change how we use the language?

kind regards,

Swisscheese

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PostPosted: Mon 14 Jan 2013 4:17 am 
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swisscheese wrote:
Do we all have to change how we use the language?

Only if you want to suck up to officials in Dublin. :LOL:

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PostPosted: Mon 14 Jan 2013 4:26 am 
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lol

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PostPosted: Mon 14 Jan 2013 8:59 am 
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The rules were relaxed a bit to allow a few more dialect forms, but other than that, the standard hasn't really changed. If you write something according to the old standard, it will still conform to the new rules (at least from what I've seen of them).

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PostPosted: Mon 14 Jan 2013 2:09 pm 
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The so-called "allowed dialectal forms" weren't always properly chosen (eg. to write "chí-" in Ulster while everybody says "tchí-"), and I wonder why certain forms are allowed and not others. Looks like they have chosen they at random.

Quote:
Do we all have to change how we use the language?


:darklaugh: Not me anyway, I didn't write in the standard before and I still don't write in the standard and I guess I'll write in the standard when they accept all Donegal forms in the standard :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

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PostPosted: Tue 15 Jan 2013 1:43 pm 
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For me it means that I can now allow my students to write Chuaigh muid instead of Chuamar, for example. I never marked this as incorrect before, but I was aware that it wasn't meant to be accepted in standard Irish. If I am to teach the (written) language and correct State exams properly - i.e. using the Official Standard as a guide - then I have some updating to do in terms of my knowledge of what is acceptable.

BTW, I think it says somewhere that the whole thing will be reviewed in three years' time.


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PostPosted: Wed 16 Jan 2013 10:15 am 
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Quote:
For me it means that I can now allow my students to write Chuaigh muid instead of Chuamar

I never understood this, why they did ever use -amar when it was only said in Clare Irish, which died out in the 1950s (except for two brothers who
lived into the 1990s), before the standard was created.

Chuaigh muid makes much more sense, since people actually use it.

Quote:
then I have some updating to do in terms of my knowledge of what is acceptable.

Are dialectal forms unmentioned by the Caighdeán unacceptable in State exams? I don't mean this to start a big debate I'm actually
just curious.

For instance would
Tá dhá bhoin aigesna fearaibh = The men have two cows
be acceptable.

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PostPosted: Wed 16 Jan 2013 11:50 am 
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Quote:
re dialectal forms unmentioned by the Caighdeán unacceptable in State exams? I don't mean this to start a big debate I'm actually
just curious.


they were unacceptable in written exams in Coleraine University when I was there, anyway.

Quote:
For instance would
Tá dhá bhoin aigesna fearaibh = The men have two cows
be acceptable.


bheadh iongantas orm!

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PostPosted: Wed 16 Jan 2013 1:33 pm 
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An Lon Dubh wrote:
Quote:
For me it means that I can now allow my students to write Chuaigh muid instead of Chuamar

I never understood this, why they did ever use -amar when it was only said in Clare Irish, which died out in the 1950s (except for two brothers who
lived into the 1990s), before the standard was created.

Chuaigh muid makes much more sense, since people actually use it.

Quote:
then I have some updating to do in terms of my knowledge of what is acceptable.

Are dialectal forms unmentioned by the Caighdeán unacceptable in State exams? I don't mean this to start a big debate I'm actually
just curious.

For instance would
Tá dhá bhoin aigesna fearaibh = The men have two cows
be acceptable.


Personally, I've never come across anything like this in the course of doing corrections. But Lughaidh is right. It isn't accepted. However beautiful and authentic the dialectal forms are, the language has been standardised in its written form anyway. That standard is what is taught and what is therefore expected in written exams.

Having said that, if I came across someone with great dialectal Irish, I would be very hestitant to find fault with it. But in truth I would not have permission to set my own rules.

Another problem with the correction of dialectal Irish is that I, as an examiner, would need to know all the dialects and obscure variants of pretty much everything in Irish. It's hard enough to get Irish teachers and correctors. It's harder still to get good ones - and even those with 'native' Irish, don't necessarily know other dialects well enough.


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PostPosted: Wed 16 Jan 2013 1:43 pm 
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Thanks Scooby.

Actually, would anybody here know why the -amar was chosen for the Caighdeán?

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