Muimhniseoir wrote:
I'm sorry to hear about the decline of Irish in the Rinn Gaedhealtacht. I noticed a lot of building/new builds in the area when I was there - I can't imagine they were to be occupied by Irish-speakers. That can't have helped the situation.
Ya that's correct, there was murder over that. The houses also blocked the view of the Coinigéar and Dungarvan bay. There was talk of a few brown envelopes too. The new houses didn't help the situation at all, as you know yourself when an English speaking person enters the gaedhealtacht the residents converse in English. Irish is however, in decline in Ring with awhile. Ring isn't as isolated from Urban areas as other Gaedhealtachtaighe either which is also a factor.
Muimhniseoir wrote:
That's good to hear
Real Irish vs. C.O. brings to mind the difference between real butter and margarine.
"I can't believe it's not Gaeilge!" might have been a more apt name for the caighdeán oifigeamhail
That's the best analogy of the Caighdeán that I've heard in awhile.
Muimhniseoir wrote:
If you don't mind, I've a few questions about Rinn Irish - as you know it today:
(a) Is the indirect article still a/ar (go/gur in the rest of Munster)?
(b) Is the 2nd. person imperative ending still -igí (-idh in the rest of Munster)?
(c) Is ó next to a nasal consonant still pronounced ú?
(d) Is sula(r) used or is it sara(r) as in the rest of Munster? Or is fé consistently used instead of either to mean 'before'?
(e) Is nín still used?
(f) Is do b' (as in do b'é, do b'fhéidir etc.) used there?
(g)Is the first consonant of the past tense of autonamous verbs still lenited (bhriseadh instead of briseadh)?
Not at all, I'll try my best, I am not the most authoritive person, so I can only go on what I've heard over 3 years, while attending Secondary school down there.
I have labeled them alphabetically to make it more understandable:
(a) my grammar terminology isn't great so, could you put what you mean into a sentence? I should cop what your getting at then. But if you mean that "a" is said instead of "go" and "ar" is used instead " "gur", then no its not. But give me an example of what you mean. However, in some phrases the "go" is not pronounced at all e.g Chuaigh sé go dtí an chathair would be pronounced in speech as:
Chuaigh or Chua' sé ' dtí'n chathair- if you say it fast enough it sounds like the "go" has been changed for an "a"- Chua' sé a dtí'n chathair. So, that may explain this. I have never seen "a" represented as "go" before in writing
(b) I have heard both, "igí" is used much more often and is a result of the Caighdeán destroying the dialect.
(c) That is still very common in An Rinn still for example- gnó is pronounced as gnú, trathnóna is trathnúna (the th is guttural) and nú is nó (but I believe nú is nó in all of Munster's sub dialects).
(d) This one I am not 100% assured of. But I believe the munster form sara or sarar is used. fé is used for before in certain phrases like fé dheireadh/ fé dheiridh.
(e) Nín, very good. Older speakers and those that are still rooted in the language use it, but its on its last legs. I haven't heard any young person use it- again an influence of the caighdeán. I use it of course because that's the way it used to be and that is the way, I believe, it should remain.
(f) Yes to a certain extent but not to the same extent as other Gaedhealtachts. I remember our class adopted "do" soon after getting involved with Maidhc Dainín. Before that not really- Caighdeán again.
(g) That's correct Ring is the only dialect I believe who séimhiú the aimsir chaite saoghar- bhriathar. We first came across this while being thaught by Ciarán Ó Gealbháin in 4th year, when we were looking at some works by Ring authors. Before that, no, my class never used it. But then when we discovered so, we all started using it- but of course not in writing because that's not allowed due to the caighdeán.
That said Ring Irish still contains some of her original beauty:
Dé is used instead of cén: Dé chúis and never cén fáth or canathaobh (Kerry)
Fuireach(t)- pronounced f'reach(t) instead of fanacht
"i" in most words is pronounced like the "i" in faighte or the "i" letter in English- it is rarely pronounce like an "ee"- for example Cill (church/ church yard) is pronounced like the name "kyle" and not like keel or Kill, Im (butter) is like the "I'm" of English instead of the Kerry im- eem and the Cork "im".
Faighte interestingly enough is pronounce like fwit- a, faighte is fachta I believe in Kerry?
On a funny note, maighstreás/ máistreás should not be used to address a female teacher in Ring- BIG mistake- found that out the hard way
,
- It is the norm to address a teacher máistreás in Kerry. But máistreás is only used for MISTRESS in Ring
as soon as I said it there was a fit of laughter and a not to impressive, half a wry smile, look on the teachers face
. I was used to máistreás because I attended a Gaodhalsgoil where all the teachers were from Kerry and did my Junior Cert through Irish were most of my teachers were from Cork. It is grand to address a male teacher as maighstir/ máistir (pronounced my-sh-ter). A mhuinteoir is the correct way to address a female teacher. In ring Irish there is no fada on the first a in both maighstreás or maighstear/ maighstir or if there is its not pronounced.
_________________
Is Fearr súil romhainn ná ḋá ṡúil inár ndiaiḋ
(Amhlaoibh Ó Súilleabháin)
Please wait for corrections/ more input from other forum members before acting on advice
I'm familiar with Munster Irish/ Gaolainn na Mumhan (GM) and the Official Standard/an Caighdeán Oifigiúil (CO)
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