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PostPosted: Sun 31 May 2026 1:00 pm 
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I've realised that An Phoirtingéil should be feminine. GCh has An Phortaingéil with a broad rt.


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PostPosted: Sun 31 May 2026 9:58 pm 
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I've been busy trying to figure out how to do OCR.
I thought that if we're to be reading Beatha Theobald Wolfe Tone, it would be good to have the base text at hand. Which we do, but having it in the thread in a digital form would be even better.
Thanks again for your notes, David. And thank you Séamus for providing information on CDh Irish.

Page 1 of the (S)Hawk's translation below.
(I still need to figure out how to preprocess the images well and so on. I simply took photos of the pages; perhaps using a printer will help. But I don't want to destroy the book.)

An Seabhac wrote:
BEATHA WOLFE TONE
I
ÓIGE WOLFE TONE
1763-1782.
Tuairisc ar a mhuinntir, ar a dheartháracha agus ae a dheirfír. Tone ar scoil. A bheagdhícheall chun foghluma. Suim i saighdiúireacht. A dhul go Coláiste na Tríonóide.
PARIS, Lughnasa 7, 1796.

Ó thárlaidh go mbead i gcionn roinnt laethe ag dul i mbun gnótha nach fios cad é a dheireadh, bainfead feidhm as an tráth atá ar mo thoil agam chun beagán a chur ar pháipéar, im thaobh féin agus i dtaobh mo mhuinntire, a dhéanfaidh adhbhar taithnimh dom chlainn mhac má thagann ar ball ar láimh chuca.
Rugadh mé i mBaile Átha Cliath an 20adh lá de'n Mheitheamh, I763. Feirmeoir conáigh dob eadh mo sheanathair i n-aice le Nás na Rí i gConntae Chill Dara. Thuit sé lá de stáca d'á chuid féin agus marbhuigheadh é agus tháinig a chuid, fé léas saorghabháltais, ar seilbh m'athar, an mac ba shine leis, a bhí ar an am san go rathmhar i mbun gnótha 'na shaor cóiste. D'á bhrí sin do chuir sé an talamh, a tháinig mar sin chuige, ar cíos chun an dearthár dob óige bhí aige, ní d'á dtáinig iomad de chúrsaí dlí eatartha ar deireadh, gurbh é críoch a bhí ar an scéal ná breithiúntas i gcúirt an tSainsiléara i gcoinnibh m'athar, rud d'fhág beo bocht 'na dhiaidh é — ach tráchtfam air sin arís.
Lamport dob ainm dom mháthair agus inghean dob eadh í do Chaptaen luinge a bhíodh ag tráchtáil do'n India Thoir, agus, do réir na scéalta fuaireas air óm mháthair, duine ar leith dob eadh é. Do bhí deartháir aici a bhí 'na mharaidhe tréitheach agus a bhí 'na


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PostPosted: Tue 02 Jun 2026 4:30 am 
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djwebb2021 wrote:
Fuair sé faill, fiú amháin, san inead úiríseal agus sa bhall uaigneach úd, chun a aigne ’ shaothrú roinnt, ionas gurbh iúnadh liom, nuair a casadh i Lúndain orm é, tar éis é ’ bheith scartha linn ocht mbliana, measaim, go bhfuaras iompar duine uasail ann, agus eólas cuíosach aige ar na ranna is feárr de litríocht an Bhéarla. Do bhí éirim filíochta ó dhúchas ann, agus bhí san saothraithe go maith aige agus tá agam, i measc mo chuid páipéar, leabhar dá chuid dánta, iad uile go deas agus cuid acu go snasta. Buachaill breá dea-dhéanaimh dob ea é, é dea-labhartha, agus taithneamh mór ag mnáibh do agus cion thar cuímse aige-sin orthu-san. Sháraigh sé Caesar i gcalmacht, agus bhí éileamh ar an arm aige. Ní fhéadfadh aon bheirt fhear cion níos dílse agus, mura miste dhom á rá, níos díograsaí a bheith ar a chéile acu ná mar ’ bhí ag beirt againn-na; agus, i láthair na huaire seo, níl [aon] ní is mó ’ ghoilleann orm ná sinn a bheith scartha ó chéile.
Tar éis a trí nú a ceathair de bhlianta ’ chaitheamh san Úróip, agus m’athair, mar aduart, go beó bocht tar éis na gcúrsaí dlí do bhí idir é féin agus a dhriotháir, bheartaigh William dul ag lorg a fhoirtiúin uair eile go hIndia agus, ó bheith dhom féin i ndeireadh na feide i gcúrsaí airgid, níor ghabhas orm a mhalairt a chómhairliú dho. Dá bhrí sin, chuaigh sé ar ais i seirbhís na Cuallachta i dtosach na bliana agus do shrois Madras tuairim deireadh na bliana san. Trí fheabhas a dhea-phearsan agus a dhea-labharthachta, mar aon leis na dea-thréithe eile d’áiríos a bheith ann, bhuaigh sé céim chómh hárd san i dtuairim Colonel an chatha ’na dtug sé seirbhís, go dtug súd cead scurtha dho, agus leitreacha chun a cháirde i gCalcutta, agus oifigeachas beag armála mar aon leis sin, ní a thug turas gan chostas do. Do sholáthraigh sé ’na theannta san do ón gCuallacht nuair a shrois ceann cúrsa, caogaid púnt airgid mar bhronntanas gradaim mar gheall ar a dhea-iompar ar an slí. B’é gníomh a dhein sé ná gur chuir sé fé chois ceannairc bhagarthach d’éirigh i measc na ndubh-shaighdiúirí féna réir go raibh rún ceilge ceapaithe acu chun na luinge ’ ghabháil agus imeacht léi.
Do cheap an mhuíntir go dtug sé na leitreacha aitheantais dóibh i gCalcutta tuairim chómh maith san do gur chuireadar in aithne é le mór-mholadh do Mr. Marigny, oifigeach Franncach, an tarna duine in uachtaránacht an airm ag an Nísam, agus a bhí an uair chéanna i gCalcutta ag ceannach stór armála don phriúnsa san. Thug Marigny, mar gheall air sin, inead oifigigh do i seirbhís an Nísaim agus do gheall ceannas a thabhairt do ar chath órdanáis (an tseirbhís ba rogha leis) chómh luath agus do shroisfidís an t-arm. Nuair a bhí na stóir, &rl, ceannaithe, ghluais William leis an gcéad roínn, féna cheannas féin, agus do bhain longphort an Nísaim amach gan óspairt. I gcionn tamaill tháinig Marigny, leis, chun cínn, ach, trí óspairt gan choinne, d’imigh leaghadh cúir na habhann ar an uile abhar dóchais dá raibh ageam dhriotháir. D’éirigh easaontas idir Mharigny agus an Franncach uachtaráin, agus ní leogfadh an mhí-dhiscréid onóra dom dhriotháir gan páirt a ghabháil ar thaobh a charad ann. B’é ’ tháinig as gur cuireadh Marigny i ngéibhinne, agus d’imeódh an íde chéanna ar William mura mbeadh é d’éileamh coimirce, i dtaobh bheith ’na ghéillsineach don Bhreatain, ar an gCómhnaitheach Sasanach i gcúirt an Nísaim.


Notes:
chun a aigne ' shaothrú roinnt: at its root this might possibly be Béarlachas. Ó Dónaill lists has it in his dictionary in the same context as it is used here: chiúnaigh an aimsir roinnt
saothrú: pronounced saorthú
tar éis é ' bheith scartha linn ocht mbliana: original, tar éis a bheith scartha linn ocht mbliana, both are correct, where the second one is using a possessive adjective construction rather than a noun phrase in the first one, i.e. 'after he was seperated from us for eight years' vs 'after his being seperated from us for eight years'
fuaras duine uasail ann: literally, 'I found the carrying of a gentleman in him', 'I found him to/I found that he carry/carried himself like a gentleman'
Do bhí éirim filíochta ó dhúchas ann: 'he had a natural talent/naturally had a talent for poetry'
saothraithe: pronounced saoraithe
dea-dhéanaimh+dea-labhartha: normally deá-dhéanaimh and deá-labhartha in CDh
mór: most often pronounced muar, though it is also transcribed pronounced /mu:r/ in Wagner's works, and Kenneth Jackson in his book Scéalta ón mBlascaod remarks that this is the only form found in Peig's speech.
ag: pronounced (and often spelled) aige, with the stress on the first syllable as opposed to aige with the stress on the second syllable (i.e. the third person masculine form of the pronoun). Can be shortened to 'ge especially following vowels and preceding articles
Sháraigh sé Caesar i gcalmacht: I believe ar chalmacht, as it has in the original, would work in this context
díograsaí: díoghraisighe in the original
againn-na: this would be againn-ne in CDh Irish
i láthair na huaire seo: ar an uair seo in the original also works. It seems that PÓS uses ar as a temporal preposition more than I am used to seeing in CDh Irish, e.g. ar an am san, ar an uair seo vs ag an am/san am/etc. as would be expected in the Caighdeán
tar éis na gcúrsaí dlí: how would one look at bracketing of genitives in the plural? This is not a clear example since cúrsa has the same plural in both the nominative and genitive, but what if there one were to bracket off a noun phrase where the first plural noun had a different genitive plural? I would assume it would take the same mutation (i.e. eclipsis) as would be expected from the genitive plural article normally (e.g. obair na bhfir dhlí), but what if there was no article? Would it take lenition as does the singular genitive dual (e.g. hataí fhir dhlí)?
ag lorg a fhoirtiúin: ag cuardach a fhortúna in the original. The latter (fortúna) genitive form is used in CDh
níor ghabhas: in both David's edition and the original. A more proper spelling in accordance to the dialect is níor ghaibheas, pronounced /n´i:r ɣais/ (gaibh is an irregular verb in CDh Irish)
ar ais: thar n-ais in CDh
do shrois: used instead of sroich in CDh and (I assume) throughout the rest of Munster
tuairim: as a preposition 'about'
trí: tré in the original. Both are found in CDh
deigh-: for of deagh- used before slender consonants. Now superceded, deá- is found before both broad and slender consonants
d'áiríos: d'áirmhigheas in the original
i dtuairim Colonel an chatha: i dtuairim Cholonel an chatha in the original. Grammatically it is often stated to be incorrect to lenite foreign titles/names, but I find it quite common in the casual speech of the dialect (though it is somewhat unfitting in this context). This is also another bracketed genitive construction: i dtuairim [C(h)olonel an chatha]
scurtha: = scortha (Caighdeánaithe)
sholáthraigh: pronounced /ho'la:rhəg´/ in CDh
caogaid púnt: caoga púnt in the original, neither are used commonly among native speakers. A more correct native form to CDh Irish would be deich bpúnt is daichead (even though the former forms are considered more native to the Irish language, whereas the latter, vigesimal system came from the French influence on the Irish language).
mar gheall ar a dhea-iompar: as ucht a dheighiomchuir (= deá-iúmpar) as is found in the original would work too
b'é gníomh a dhein sé: the lack of the definite article before gníomh is talked about by Pádraig Ó Laoghaire in his book Notes on Irish Words and Usages. To summarise, gníomh is already defined by the following verb, therefor erasing the need for the article
féna réir: would fé 'na riar as given in the original not be more correct here?
chun na luinge ' ghabháil: chun an long a ghabháil in the original. Prepositional verbal noun clauses such as this one often treat the noun + verb construction as one unit, bracketing it off (as in the latter), but this is not a set rule.
gabháil: pronounced /gva:l´/ ~ /gwa:l´/, also exists the form gabháilt (/gva:l´t´/ ~ /gwa:l´t´/)
dara: tarna is used in Munster (including CDh)
ag ceannach stór armála: another bracketed construction
don phriúnsa: more often don bpriúnsa in modern CDh Irish. Older texts have both, often favouring the former. 'on, however (preposition of direction) takes lenition.
&rl.: abbreviation of agus araile 'et cetera'. The Gaelic script uses the tironian et instead of the ampersand of the latin script (i.e. ⁊rl.). However, as this symbol was very rarely found on type writers, it was often substituted with the number 7, as they are both similar in appearance, giving 7rl. in the original.
bain: pronounced /bin´/ in Munster Irish
i gcionn: dative form of ceann, one of the few masculine nouns with a distinct dative form. The dative form is not functional, and only exists in modern day CDh Irish in set phrases.
gan choinne: 'unexpected(ly)'
d'imigh leaghadh cúir na habhann ar ...: literally: 'the melting of the foam on the river befell ...'. An unbracketed construction (d'imigh leaghadh [cúir] [na habhann] ar .... (I apologise if it is confusing calling it an unbracketed construction, then using brackets to illustrate the grammar :darklaugh: Each unit following leaghadh is in the genitive, thus signaling that they are not being bracketed together as one unit, another way to illustrate it is simply d'imigh leaghadh cúir na habhann ar ..., without brackets.)
carad: genitive of cara treated as a fifth declension noun. Both cara and carad are found as genitive forms in modern day CDh
b'é ' tháinig as gur cuireadh Marigny i ngéibhinne: one could also say b'é ' tháinig as gur cuireadh Marigny i ngéibhinne
muna mbeadh é d'éileamh comairce: is this do the same grammatically and functionally as the one as in téir a chodladh, etc.??

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Soir gaċ síar, fé ḋeireaḋ thíar


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PostPosted: Tue 02 Jun 2026 4:40 am 
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djwebb2021 wrote:
You say "ó thárlaidh" is more common in CD. Do you mean in the spelling only? Or do you mean that it is pronounced hárluig?


Both spelling and pronunciation.

djwebb2021 wrote:
Uim an am san: what do you think of "ar an am san"? Is that also correct? Presumably if An Seabhac had it, it must be?


I assume so. An Seabhac seems to use ar in a temporal sense (e.g. ar an uair seo) that isn't extremely common in any of the texts I've encountered

djwebb2021 wrote:
tosnaíod: this is present subjunctive. See ceannaíod in https://corkirish.wordpress.com/verb-co ... /ceannaim/ Of course, sara dtosnaíod can be sara dtosnód, as the future often/usually does replace the present subjunctive.


Interesting. I had not encountered the subjunctive after conjunctions such as sula, go, and nó go (I just checked Lars's site). So either this is extremely uncommon in modern day CDh Irish, or it just slipped under my radar for years :facepalm:

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I'm an intermediate speaker of the Corca Dhuibhne dialect of Irish and also have knowledge on the old spelling
Soir gaċ síar, fé ḋeireaḋ thíar


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PostPosted: Tue 02 Jun 2026 4:45 am 
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Would anyone benefit from an audio-text of this book? I would be more than willing to record my reading of the chapters as we go along (but obviously, I'm not a native speaker, so one should not expect any sort of perfection in my speech, as only natives retain a purely correct form of the language).

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PostPosted: Tue 02 Jun 2026 7:08 am 
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The d' in é d'éileamh means the same as if you wrote é a éileamh. It's the particle governing the verbal noun. Rud do dhéanamh or rud a dhéanamh.


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PostPosted: Tue 02 Jun 2026 7:13 am 
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As far as I know, réir is réir in all cases, although in the 18th century the nominative was riar.


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