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PostPosted: Sun 05 Feb 2023 2:20 am 
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Joined: Fri 22 Jan 2021 4:24 pm
Posts: 93
Haigh, a Chairde! :wave: I was on YouTube today watching some Irish language videos, and I came across a video where an Irish language teacher was doing a presentation on the Modh Coinníollach. I was intrigued by her pronunciation of the 2nd Conjugation verb endings. By her accent, she’s clearly from somewhere in the north of Ireland.

For example, she says “Ní chríochnódh sé” as “nee hree(kh)-NO-oo shay”

I know (partly because of help from some some of y’all in the past, and partly from An Teanga Bheo: Gaeilge Uladh) that the Ulster ending is typically pronounced as oh-hoo/aw-hoo (with an “h” sound between the syllables, because of the original Ulster ending “óchadh”)…but, I have to admit, that (as well as the Ulster future tense ending) has been a mouthful for me, so I was intrigued by a potential alternate Ulster pronunciation when I heard the video.

Do any of you know if her pronunciation is a good example of an alternative Ulster pronunciation of the 2nd conjugation endings? Or perhaps it isn’t actually a “different” pronunciation at all: that is, perhaps she is simply speaking in a more natural way than I have been, and what I’m hearing in her pronunciation is just a much toned down “h.” … I have the tendency to over pronounce my “h” sound, I think…and it ends up feeling unnatural and like too much breath/effort :darklaugh:

Granted, before a pronoun starting with “s,” I think she was “supposed to” pronounce the ending like a “t” sound, and the stress should have been on the first syllable, not the second…so it maybe should’ve been “nee HREE(kh)-no-utt shay” / “nee HREE-naw-hutt shay”

But, anyway, I’ll put the link here, if anyone wants to check it out and share your thoughts? Thank you so much! https://youtu.be/POUjMVQquYo


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PostPosted: Sun 05 Feb 2023 6:53 am 
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Joined: Thu 27 May 2021 3:22 am
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Rosie_Oleary wrote:
Haigh, a Chairde! :wave: I was on YouTube today watching some Irish language videos, and I came across a video where an Irish language teacher was doing a presentation on the Modh Coinníollach. I was intrigued by her pronunciation of the 2nd Conjugation verb endings. By her accent, she’s clearly from somewhere in the north of Ireland.

For example, she says “Ní chríochnódh sé” as “nee hree(kh)-NO-oo shay”

I know (partly because of help from some some of y’all in the past, and partly from An Teanga Bheo: Gaeilge Uladh) that the Ulster ending is typically pronounced as oh-hoo/aw-hoo (with an “h” sound between the syllables, because of the original Ulster ending “óchadh”)…but, I have to admit, that (as well as the Ulster future tense ending) has been a mouthful for me, so I was intrigued by a potential alternate Ulster pronunciation when I heard the video.

Do any of you know if her pronunciation is a good example of an alternative Ulster pronunciation of the 2nd conjugation endings? Or perhaps it isn’t actually a “different” pronunciation at all: that is, perhaps she is simply speaking in a more natural way than I have been, and what I’m hearing in her pronunciation is just a much toned down “h.” … I have the tendency to over pronounce my “h” sound, I think…and it ends up feeling unnatural and like too much breath/effort :darklaugh:

Granted, before a pronoun starting with “s,” I think she was “supposed to” pronounce the ending like a “t” sound, and the stress should have been on the first syllable, not the second…so it maybe should’ve been “nee HREE(kh)-no-utt shay” / “nee HREE-naw-hutt shay”

But, anyway, I’ll put the link here, if anyone wants to check it out and share your thoughts? Thank you so much! https://youtu.be/POUjMVQquYo



You mean from 02:29 in the video onwards. I'd be interested to see what Caoimhín says, as he has expertise on Ulster Irish. My hunch is that this is not a native speaker. As you point out, she doesn't stress the right syllable. She also says "crannchur" as "cranncur". If you've been told chríochnódh is chríochnothú in Ulster, I'd go with that. A lot of people in the "Irish language movement" refuse to accept the distinction between a native L1 speaker and an L2 learner... and insist any pronunciation errors are just an "Antrim accent", so there are political issues surrounding this. If she's a native speaker she needs to e.g. come from Rann na Féirste or Tory Island, not Belfast.


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PostPosted: Sun 05 Feb 2023 10:31 am 
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Joined: Thu 15 Sep 2011 12:06 pm
Posts: 2431
Wow... soooo many problems in the pronunciation in this video. Wrong things as well as non-Ulster things (she pronounced broad mh and bh like v... which doesn't exist in Ulster except before consonants). She pronounces ch like c most of the time. Slender "nn"'s are pronounced like "n", etc etc. Her endings in -ódh etc aren't pronounced properly either.
Too bad most people who make videos to teach Irish on Youtube don't master the language or at least don't master its pronunciation...

Also, the grammar she teaches is standard Irish (often based on Munster Irish). You won't hear "an bpósfaidís" in Ulster, it's Munster Irish.
Afaik "éist" is "d'éisteóchadh" in the conditional, not "d'éistfeadh" (it's a bit irregular).
She pronounces -fadh sé/sí/sibh like -hoo shay/shee/shiv but I think nobody pronounces like that anywhere, it's -hutt shah/shee/shiv.

Why don't native speakers (Gaeltacht ones) make such videos? And teach the Irish they really speak... **sigh**

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Is fearr Gaeilg na Gaeltaċta ná Gaeilg ar biṫ eile
Agus is í Gaeilg Ġaoṫ Doḃair is binne
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PostPosted: Sun 05 Feb 2023 7:11 pm 
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Joined: Fri 22 Jan 2021 4:24 pm
Posts: 93
Thank raibh maith agaibh to you both for giving me your thoughts on this! That’s what I mostly suspected: that her pronunciation probably isn’t native and isn’t the best choice to imitate. :good: I want to be as authentic as possible. I’ve been working hard on my pronunciations lately and am even improving on my slender r’s! :D While her particular pronunciations were not correct, I do think I’ve been saying my
“-óchadh”s/“-óchaidh”s a little too breathy and choppy, and that’s something I’m going to continue to work on.

Thank you both again! :wave:


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