It is currently Sat 18 Nov 2017 7:05 pm

All times are UTC


Forum rules


Please click here to view the forum rules



Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 9 posts ] 
Author Message
 Post subject: Corrections please
PostPosted: Thu 31 Aug 2017 6:33 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu 01 Sep 2011 9:55 am
Posts: 1803
Location: 91 - France
They found the path and I found the puddle.
They were drowned and I was found.
If it's all one to me tonight,
it wasn't all one to them the next night.
Yet, if it wasn't itself
not a thing did they lose
but an old black tooth.


Fuair siadsan an cósan agus fuair mise an lochán uisce.
Bhádar siadsan agus fuarthas mise.
Más ionann an cás domsa é anocht,
níorbh ionann an cás dóibh é an oíche arna mhárach.
Ach fós féin murar raibh í féin
aon ní a chaill siad
ach seanfhiacail dhubh.

(This is how Old Mourteen ended a story for J.M. Synge)


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Corrections please
PostPosted: Thu 31 Aug 2017 8:58 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sat 07 Feb 2015 11:24 am
Posts: 438
Location: Baile Mhic Ghoilla Eoin, VA
I am afraid I simply don't understand the original English at all.
I will point out that the word should be cosán it seems you misspelled it by mistake.
And perhaps for the second sentence rather use Bhíodar báite agus bhíos-sa faighte (it rhymes nicely!)
But beyond that I simply have no idea what is intended.

Maybe for more rhyme
Fuaireadar an cosán ach fuaireas féin an lochán
Bhíodar báite agus bhíos-sa faighte

hahah i don't know
like I said I don't really know what it means anyway

_________________
ЯГОН ТОҶИК НЕСТ ИНҶО???


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Corrections please
PostPosted: Thu 31 Aug 2017 9:19 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu 01 Sep 2011 9:55 am
Posts: 1803
Location: 91 - France
In oral tradition, not only in Irish but in other languages as well, it is usual to end and sometimes to begin a story with what Synge called gibberish. It's a kind of formulaic nonsense which has been interpreted being vaguely magical in its way, perhaps you could call it bewildering - I suppose it has the function of telling you that you are leaving the imaginary world where the story is set and you're coming back to the real world. I hope that doesn't sound too highbrow.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Corrections please
PostPosted: Fri 01 Sep 2017 3:08 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sat 07 Feb 2015 11:24 am
Posts: 438
Location: Baile Mhic Ghoilla Eoin, VA
franc 91 wrote:
In oral tradition, not only in Irish but in other languages as well, it is usual to end and sometimes to begin a story with what Synge called gibberish. It's a kind of formulaic nonsense which has been interpreted being vaguely magical in its way, perhaps you could call it bewildering - I suppose it has the function of telling you that you are leaving the imaginary world where the story is set and you're coming back to the real world. I hope that doesn't sound too highbrow.

I can't decide if I think that sounds fun or awful. But whichever way I decide I know I will feel strongly about it. Hmmm indeed.

_________________
ЯГОН ТОҶИК НЕСТ ИНҶО???


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Corrections please
PostPosted: Fri 01 Sep 2017 7:02 am 
Offline

Joined: Thu 01 Sep 2011 9:55 am
Posts: 1803
Location: 91 - France
Well all I can say is that it has been translated from Irish, unfortunately the original isn't available. Sometimes there's a piece of unexpected luck - somebody found Holger Pedersen's original transcriptions that he made when he was in the Aran Islands just before Synge got there, which were hidden amongst his papers in a library in Denmark, so you can now buy 'Scéalta Mháirtín Neile' - ISBN 978 0 906426 17 3 . The other reference book I've managed to get hold of (second-hand), which you might like to read is 'Synge and the Irish Language' by Declan Kiberd ISBN 978 0 333 26229 8 where he makes the point that in spite of being criticised by literary critics, most of them didn't have any Irish.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Corrections please
PostPosted: Fri 08 Sep 2017 2:33 pm 
Offline

Joined: Fri 09 Sep 2011 2:06 pm
Posts: 511
franc 91 wrote:
They found the path and I found the puddle.
They were drowned and I was found.
If it's all one to me tonight,
it wasn't all one to them the next night.
Yet, if it wasn't itself
not a thing did they lose
but an old black tooth.


Fuair siadsan an cósan agus fuair mise an lochán uisce.
Bhádar siadsan agus fuarthas mise.
Más ionann an cás domsa é anocht,
níorbh ionann an cás dóibh é an oíche arna mhárach.
Ach fós féin murar raibh í féin
aon ní a chaill siad
ach seanfhiacail dhubh.

(This is how Old Mourteen ended a story for J.M. Synge)


:prof: Is léir nach raibh tú ag éisteacht... http://irishlanguageforum.co...ed6fc358db8ffd44835
That link seems not to be working. The last post was 30 May (by yourself), currently on page 6.

More to come. Franc91, do not reply yet.

- 'Bhádar siadsan': You need the autonomous form here - Bádh iadsan - just as you had in that previous post.

- 'aon ní a chaill siad ach': This isn't a negative. Again, you had it correct grammatically in your previous post - 'níl aon ní...', though I think something like 'níor chiall siad ach' would be more natural. However, this wouldn't't give the emphasis of 'not a thing did they lose but' which might be better translated as 'd(h)eamhan rud a chaill siad ach'

- 'murar raibh í féin': You have to use the copula because that's what you've already used ('Is ionann an cás...'. ) - murarbh ionann féin

(Problems with posting, hence all the apparent edits)


Last edited by Errigal on Fri 08 Sep 2017 4:16 pm, edited 5 times in total.

Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Corrections please
PostPosted: Fri 08 Sep 2017 2:56 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu 01 Sep 2011 9:55 am
Posts: 1803
Location: 91 - France
I'd just come back from holiday in the South of France and I'd forgotten that I had already posted it here before - tá brón orm :oops:


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Corrections please
PostPosted: Sat 09 Sep 2017 11:21 am 
Offline

Joined: Fri 09 Sep 2011 2:06 pm
Posts: 511
I added some more stuff to my post after you'd posted, so you may not have seen it.

Obviously you could also say something like an t-aon rud a chaill siad (ná) s.d./s.d. an t-aon rud a chaill siad (or ) instead of rud of course).


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Corrections please
PostPosted: Sat 09 Sep 2017 1:48 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu 01 Sep 2011 9:55 am
Posts: 1803
Location: 91 - France
Go raibh maith agat, a chara ;)


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 9 posts ] 

All times are UTC


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Bing [Bot], Google [Bot], kennedy17 and 18 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group