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 Post subject: Well-known
PostPosted: Sun 10 Jun 2012 8:53 pm 
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Location: 91 - France
This is taken from the introduction to the Irish/English version of Clann Lir published by Mantra Lingua and I'm wondering whether the fada should be there or not - as I can't find áirde in the dictionary, but anyway I don't understand how ainm in áirde means 'well-known'.

Do bhí ainm in áirde ar Cheiltigh na h-Éireann agus Breataine mar gheal ar a ngrá don scéalaíocht.
which is translated as -
The Celtic peoples of the British Isles were well-known for their love of story-telling.


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 Post subject: Re: Well-known
PostPosted: Sun 10 Jun 2012 9:03 pm 
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Ainm in airde = a name in (the) height...

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 Post subject: Re: Well-known
PostPosted: Sun 10 Jun 2012 9:30 pm 
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Standard Irish never uses a síneadh fada before rd or rn (and rl I think?). Examples: garda, bard, cairde, carn. It just looks like non-standard (older?) stuff, including h-Éireann - the hyphen after the prefixed h is non-standard.


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 Post subject: Re: Well-known
PostPosted: Sun 10 Jun 2012 9:45 pm 
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So - áirde is a mistake, as I thought it might be. I also think that this version is written on purpose in an older style or at least in Munster - using 'do' systematically before the past tense for example.
GRMA


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 Post subject: Re: Well-known
PostPosted: Mon 11 Jun 2012 2:14 pm 
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Let's say non-standard rather than erroneous. Although mar gheal should be mar gheall. Using do before verbs is a Munster thing, but that's because Munster Irish tends to use more of the older forms which were once more widespread. (d'ith is along the lines of do bhí and it's still used everywhere).


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 Post subject: Re: Well-known
PostPosted: Mon 11 Jun 2012 2:43 pm 
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Location: 91 - France
That was my mistake - I copied it down wrongly, you're right - gheall with two 'l's - though I must say, I didn't know this expression - mar gheall ar - meaning because of, or - as a result of, and in the dictionary it's also - i ngeall (though that must be a question of dialect, I suppose). I always thought geall meant a bet or a wager (which comes from - une gageure in French and is connected the word wages) but I see it can be used in several ways - geall aim duit (go) I assure you (that), geall le - virtually, practically; de gheall ar - for the sake of, in order to.


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 Post subject: Re: Well-known
PostPosted: Mon 11 Jun 2012 5:08 pm 
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FGB gives i ngeall ar; mar gheall ar = on account of

edited to say, you did say 'also', so you already know both versions are in the dictionary.


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 Post subject: Re: Well-known
PostPosted: Mon 11 Jun 2012 7:40 pm 
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Ach, but I only have the Collins Pocket (when I'm older I'm going to get me hands on those other two that everyone talks about) ;)


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 Post subject: Re: Well-known
PostPosted: Mon 11 Jun 2012 7:59 pm 
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franc 91 wrote:
Ach, but I only have the Collins Pocket (when I'm older I'm going to get me hands on those other two that everyone talks about) ;)
One can but dream! :mrgreen:

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