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PostPosted: Thu 09 Oct 2014 1:52 am 
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Hello! So I have done some research behind the translation of "Nothing is done without effort", and on many webpages (some of them language learning pages) the translation is as follows: "Tada gan iarracht". But as I was browsing some of the translation requests I came about one similar and the translation was COMPLETELY different. Help? Please? Much love! :aingeal:


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PostPosted: Thu 09 Oct 2014 7:14 am 
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Tada gan iarracht - is probably what you'd be looking for - it simply means - nothing without effort.
I've looked it up and found slightly longer versions -

Níl rud ar bith déanta gan iarracht.
Níl aon rud déanta gan iarracht.
there's also -
Ní féidir aon ní a bhaint amach gan iarracht.
Níl tada déanta gan iarracht.
and an equivalent saying in Irish - Níl saill gan saothar - There's no salting or preserving without (doing the) work


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PostPosted: Fri 10 Oct 2014 3:52 am 
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Does "tada" work without a negative verb before it? I understood "tada"/"dada" to be a tiny quantity, even if it's almost never seen outside of a "not a bit" type construction. Ó Dómnail gives "iota, jot, whit, tittle", and English analogously tended to use jot and whit commonly only in negative phrases by his time (not a jot, not a whit). (Although I'd be surprised to hear either now.)

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PostPosted: Fri 10 Oct 2014 2:27 pm 
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NiallBeag wrote:
Does "tada" work without a negative verb before it? I understood "tada"/"dada" to be a tiny quantity, even if it's almost never seen outside of a "not a bit" type construction. Ó Dómnail gives "iota, jot, whit, tittle", and English analogously tended to use jot and whit commonly only in negative phrases by his time (not a jot, not a whit). (Although I'd be surprised to hear either now.)



I've always heard that you have to have a negative verb with tada. For example Rinne mé tada is incorrect, according to my teacher, and you should say Ní dhearna mé tada


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PostPosted: Fri 10 Oct 2014 4:48 pm 
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galaxyrocker wrote:
NiallBeag wrote:
Does "tada" work without a negative verb before it? I understood "tada"/"dada" to be a tiny quantity, even if it's almost never seen outside of a "not a bit" type construction. Ó Dómnail gives "iota, jot, whit, tittle", and English analogously tended to use jot and whit commonly only in negative phrases by his time (not a jot, not a whit). (Although I'd be surprised to hear either now.)


I've always heard that you have to have a negative verb with tada. For example Rinne mé tada is incorrect, according to my teacher, and you should say Ní dhearna mé tada


I think the usage of words like tada without a negative verb, but still conveying the negative (in short expressions), may be dialectical (perhaps more common in Ulster), or an example of informal speech. Other examples:
rud ar bith
fadhb ar bith

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PostPosted: Tue 14 Oct 2014 12:15 pm 
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franc 91 wrote:
Tada gan iarracht - is probably what you'd be looking for - it simply means - nothing without effort.
I've looked it up and found slightly longer versions -

Níl rud ar bith déanta gan iarracht.
Níl aon rud déanta gan iarracht.
there's also -
Ní féidir aon ní a bhaint amach gan iarracht.
Níl tada déanta gan iarracht.
and an equivalent saying in Irish - Níl saill gan saothar - There's no salting or preserving without (doing the) work


The proverb or saying is Ní fhaightear saill gan saothar (/saothrú).

Those three versions with "Níl...déanta" suggest a state rather than an action. I'd say the action is more appropriate here: Ní dhéantar... rather than Níl...déanta.

I think "saothar" is better than "iarracht".

CaoimhínSF wrote:

I think the usage of words like tada without a negative verb, but still conveying the negative (in short expressions), may be dialectical (perhaps more common in Ulster), or an example of informal speech. Other examples:
rud ar bith
fadhb ar bith


I think a negative verb has at least to be implied from the context:

1 - Pól: "Cad é atá tú a dhéanamh?
Séan: "(Níl mé ag déanamh) Rud ar bith".

2 - P: "An dtiocfadh leat cuidiú liom?/GRMA as cuidiú liom."
S: "(Ní/Níor) Fadhb ar bith (é). (I'd suppose 'fadhb ar bith' comes straight from English anyway).


.


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