Obviously in Ireland, the most common word used to refer to the Irish language in English is simply "Irish". Although I've read comments where people claim that a lot of native speakers, particularly older native speakers would use the word "Gaelic". I've also found that native speaking teachers on YouTube such as An Loingseach and Patchy seem to use the word "Gaelic" as well as the word "Irish". Is this common for traditional speakers from Gaeltacht regions to use the word "Gaelic"? And if so is it so in all the Gaeltacht regions?

I think the first generation to become bilingual were more likely to call the language Gaelic, as it is what the language is called in Irish. Wagner's linguistic atlas of Irish dialects refers to Irish as Gaelic throughout (in the English-language questions), and was published between 1958 and 1969. On the other hand, all Irish speakers are bilingual today and it would be hard to believe any weren't exposed to English-language references to the language as "Irish". I would be surprised if anyone in Ireland preferred to refer to Irish as Gaelic today.

A relative of mine from Gaoth Dobhair only refers to it as Gaelic. I think calling it "Irish" must be an affectation of the Irish education system, because as a school subject it's referred to only as Irish, and the most vocal proponents of calling it "Irish" that I've met, who insist that it's incorrect to refer to it as "Gaelic", have all been people who were first exposed to the language in the education system.

It's interesting that you say Patchy uses the term "Gaelic", because I know he gives lessons in Irish, and to at least a few Americans. Americans, of course, seem more inclined to refer to the language as Gaelic than Irish. I wonder if his usage is reflective of this, or of some tendency in the north Mayo Gaeltacht area, where I believe he is from, to refer to the language as "Gaelic" when speaking English. If it's the latter (and I suspect it is) maybe it can be linked to dialects where the language is referred to in Irish as "Gaeilig" rather than the Connemara "Gaeilge" or Munster "Gaelainn".



I've never heard native speakers in either Munster or Connemara referring to it as "Gaelic" when speaking English. With that being said, I think I've only ever heard native speakers from Munster refer to it as "Irish" either. That's not to say that such speakers don't do so, just that I haven't experienced it. All of my acquaintances from Connemara have tended to borrow "An Ghaeilge" into English when speaking about Irish. I recall one even referring to "Seana-Ghaeilge" in English, though I never thought to question the borrowing until now, and I wonder what he would have said instead if he had thought I wouldn't understand the term "Seana-Ghaeilge".

I've heard an argument before (controversially) that the term 'Irish' may be not favourable by some native speakers (don't shoot me, this isn't me saying this!) because:

1. It was a government coined term by opposition government some 100 years ago.

2. It creates a sense of 'having secured the language' by virtue of calling it 'Irish' (i.e. 'we' the Irish people have our 'Irish' language), and we can all pat ourselves on the back for. job well done!

3. The above gives a sense that the we (the Irish people) saved our the native language.

4. It suggests a sense of 'mission complete', 'job done', 'language is flourishing throughout Ireland'. Gaelic on the other hand, conjures up a sense of a more endangered language; something at the periphery of society.

My personal opinion is broadly in agreement with the above. Personally, I use the term Irish when referring to 'Gaelic'. Interestingly, it feels somewhat uncomfortable for me, as a non-native speaker, to call it Gaelic in English.

You can draw an interesting contrast with Scotland where the term Gaelic is the only true name attributed to Scot's Gaelic. Of course, this may have something to do with the fact that there is the Scot's language, however, nobody, to my knowledge, refers to either of the languages of Scotland as 'Scottish'. The main argument I know of in Scotland amongst English speakers is whether to call it 'gey-lik' or 'gah-lik' when referring to it in English.

Despite what I have written above, below is an attachment to an article I found in the Freeman's Journal from 1852 with an article on the Irish language in which the language is referred to as 'the Irish Language'.

https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/fb45ajv1pjegfwui9eogm/Freeman_s_Journal_and_Daily_Commercial_Advertiser_1852_09_29_page_3.jpg?rlkey=jub8x1qslmm303wx91to3fxg8&dl=0

I think "Irish Gaelic" is OK as a middle choice.

I particularly don't like those in the official movement who insist that calling the language Gaelic is offensive. This is clearly an attempt to tie into a PC style synthetic outrage. Another similar thing is the concocted outrage if you refer to Connacht as Connaught (what do they think the -gh- stood for in that English form of the name?). I think there is discussion in the archives of this site of how some Irish people dislike the name Bridget - as if the English had gone to great lengths to spoil an Irish name - when in fact the original was Brighid... (apparently not a lot of people know that....)

Alan Titley (great Gaelic name there) put a note in his translation into English of Cré na Cille on how the Irish language cannot be called Gaelic. So I put a note in my edition of Peadar Ua Laogaire's Mo Scéal Féin saying this:


I think "Irish" gets at the nub of the issue - that Irish "belongs" to all the Irish people, and so the Gaeltacht people have no prior rights or higher authority with respect to it. It is not their language alone. And if committees in Dublin draw up a standard, that committee is more authoritative than the Gaeltacht. I think this is the fundamental point.

My Grandparents called it Gaelic, so I thought it was weird when I heard “Irish” the first time.

Did they say Gaeilinn with a slender l? Contrasting with Gaelainn in Muskerry?

Of course I didn’t pay attention to those things. But I THINK so.It was extremely rare that anyone discussed Irish in either language also.

Yes, it was referred to as Irish usually even then - and I think it has basically always been called Irish as its main name in the English language. When Q. Elizabeth I had a primer drawn up for her in the 1570s, it was a primer of Irish, not Gaelic. Donovan's 1845 grammar was a Grammar of the Irish Language.

But the revival organisation was the Gaelic League, and their journal was the Gaelic Journal. Gaelic really refers to the unity of Gaelic, in Ireland, Scotland and the Isle of Man, rather than one specific national form, although the use of it in Scotland to refer to just Scottish Gaelic has its own specific justification (Gaelic vs. Scots). I think you could say Irish is a Gaelic language, not the Gaelic language, but use of "Gaelic" as a term by native speakers is not wrong as such.

I like Sacs-Bhéarla to refer to English, but it hasn't always been called that.